Can you hybridize a ringneck with a mustache?

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crazyparrot
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Can you hybridize a ringneck with a mustache?

Post by crazyparrot »

I was wondering is mustache parakeets and ringneck parakkets could hybridize?
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Mjay
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Post by Mjay »

I am nowhere near an expert, hopefully someone can reply to this and set the record straight, but someone told me that to get different colour mutations to breed a moustache with an IRN! not sure if that is possible, Fah?
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Fah
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Post by Fah »

I have heard of a person trying this to a massive failure. (over 12 years work to produce a mucky genepool of birds that he cant sell and dont resemble either of the two species he was working with). Some birds just dont easily swap that mutanagenic behaviour in colour either I guess.

Unlike an Alexandrine, a Moustache, even though it is an Asiatic, is very far from being able to just 'inject' a mutation into it, if that would be the ultimate goal.

I guess this is the reason you would want to do this?

There are no beneficial grounds to hybridizing any parrot, especially in a country that doesnt allow importation of new bloodlines etc, you cant guarantee a birds health... though I dont believe hybrids suffer mental issues from cross genetic problems... could be hype to scare people from doing it.

I have once seen a hybrid moustache irn before, and it simply looked like a runtish indian ringneck with a wider ringline.

For the most part... there is just too much of this hybridizing stuff going on, especially with some of the asiatics. It was previously a quiet practice that very few people did, but as dollar signs popped into peoples eyes, many people have been wanting to produce hybrid Alexandrines. Sadly, most of the offspring these people produce end up as breeding stock for people who dont know any better and are clueless as to what they actually own... often with thanks to unscrupulous sellers who do not bluntly say what it actually is.

If you truely wanted to try to inject a colour mutation into a moustache, remember that it will easily take over a decade to produce a bird of any quality that resembles the original species you were aiming for, and you will be producing many many birds in the process that will end up polluting the genepool that we have in Australia.

You cant guarantee to anyone the early generations of hybrids will merely be pets, likewise you cant actually guarantee the end result will bear resemblance exactly with the original species.

Putting it bluntly, some things should just be left as they are. As we are seeing it, the price of larger species pure (and reputatively pure) Alexandrines is actually being pushed up in value due to many people not being able to guarantee on records or quality of size that their birds are pure Alex.

There will always be accidents in multi species aviaries, and there will always be the odd hybrid floating around, but I think some of the asiatics need a bit of a break when it comes to making hybrids.

I know I sounded quite anti-hybrid, this as some people know is not entirely true... but I do, like much of the aviculture around, have limits to what is and what isnt on the thin red line.
Mjay
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Post by Mjay »

It just goes to show that you shouldn't listen to or believe everything you hear, like you Fah, everybody has an opinion(i would trust yours as you have, what i believe to be a very wide knowledge of genetics) but majority of them with no knowledge at all suffer the consequenses along with the people who choose to buy these hybrids without fully knowing what they payed for, i know a little about dogs (i know, totally off the birds lol) and all these new designer dogs have been on the most part, nothing but trouble! the puppies don't always turn out like you expect them to and they also come with many genetic problems from inexperienced backyard breeders :evil: It angers me so much that "petshops" try to sell these puppies for an obscene amount of money :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: you can't guarantee the health of an animal if you don't know what to expect :!:
Sorry, i got a little out of hand there lol :D
I hope i didn't offend anyone :oops:
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Fah
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Post by Fah »

Heh yah, the thing about hybridization is quite common in several industries, I think people like myself are more anti-hybrid with birds as we cant import new blood, so we have limited stocks to work with in many many species...

This being said, im still not entirely against it, and in some cases, when a bird is just that rare the only alternative is inbreeding, somtimes finding similar birds to hybridize it with in order to keep the other species going, with the aim to breed it back to its limited blood stock etc is perfectly manageable if you have the dedication and the time.

All I can say, is putting an IRN to a Moustache from my knowledge, will just throw runtish looking ringnecks with wider neck lines and I doubt that is what you would want to breed, as not all situations can blend well, and unfortunately in this case, these two dont mesh much at all.

If you cant find another moustache, or someone who would trade for or buy them off you, I wouldnt recommend pairing them with ringnecks, possibly just better off housing them till such a time that you can a) find them partners or b) find someone who wants them.

Dogs fall into the category of birds I think regarding hybrids as well... just because it can breed, doesnt mean it should... there are many mixed species breeds of dog out there that are very prone to certain physical issues etc, but in the same right, I know several very compatible bird species that produce lovely healthy hybrids that look fantastic to boot.

I personally prefer hybrid birds that do not look anything like their original parents, and can not be mistaken for similar species... this halts confusion, this halts accidental blending of species etc.
Mjay
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Post by Mjay »

True :D I know that with dogs aswell as horses some inbreeding goes on for bloodlines, although with horses i have heard you can't breed a father with a daughter, but you can with a son and mother, do you know if this is correct and would it apply with birds? I'm just curious i suppose :lol: i don't have any intention of mixing/breeding diff bird species (i'm just an amateur lol), I do wonder though, crazyparrot, did you hear this aswell about the mustache parrots?
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crazyparrot
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line breeding

Post by crazyparrot »

I show cockatiels, that is my main bird, and we linebreed for quality. With the cockatiels, you generally do cousins, aunts & uncles or step-siblings (you have a grand champion...Bird A...you first breed bird A with bird B, then you take bird A and put it with bird C..., you hold back the best M & F from each set and 18 months or more later, when they're mature, you breed them together.)
I currently have a uncle-niece pair...the Male took 4th in show in the advanced division at the specialty, the female took champion novice. But the best bird I have ever bred myself came fom a step-sibling (same father, different mother)

I am all too unfamiliar with other birds, but unless I had to, since I don't show them, I wouldn't linebreed.
Please check out my sites at www.southerncockatiels.com and www.crazyparrot.com
Mjay
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Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 3:37 am
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Post by Mjay »

I noticed you specialized in Cockateils :D i checked out your websites :D I am only a first time breeder (this will be my first season) :D :D :D :D
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