Retaming a hand-raised IRN

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questionare
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm

Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by questionare »

Hi Guys,

I have bought a dark blue/violet IRN; which was hand raised; and is from BanksLea Aviaries in Australia (per the leg band). The band shows it hatched in 2014, however, I don't really know the exact age, nor the sex.

I bought it from a previous owner, which seems lately was not taking care of it, although it was fully tame before (he was able to put the IRN on his back and scratch his head). However, he informed me that one of his friends frightened the IRN by grabbing him from the tail :S

The situation know is that the IRN allows me to pet him all over, scratch his head, and to step up; however, this is only if he was away from his cage, or there is no perch in the room. Otherwise, he will fly and start running away from me. Also, inside the cage, he moves away (without flying) when I change his dishes.

What is your advises to regain his trust, and re-tame him to be as before? currently I let him in his cage, with top opened, and I act normally without pushing him

Below are the IRN pictures, any help on Mutation, Age, or Sex?
Image

Image

Image

Image

Thanks
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by InTheAir »

Hi,

Congrats on your new friend. Hopefully his little tail will grow in nicely with his moult, which should happen soon, and with a good diet.

Since your bird puts up with you touching him when he has no choice, instead of biting you, I think he has a lovely temperament! But I don't recommend you continue to train him that way, it obviously isn't making him like you very much since he is avoiding you when given a choice.
Instead you can find what his favourite treats are by putting a variety of little things in a dish and watching to see what he eats first. Ringnecks generally will eat anything offered in order of preference. Once you know what he likes best, remove the favourite things from his normal diet and use them as treats. They usually seem to like the least healthy things best anyway ;)

Now you know his favourites, hold out a treat towards him and watch his response. Make sure it is easy for him to walk over to take it from you if he wants to. Also, hold it out from a distance that doesn't scare him by how close you are(ie if he is leaning or moving away that is too close). Hopefully he will walk over to you to take it. If he doesn't, drop it into a nearby dish and step back a few steps until he is happy to eat it. Repeat a few times and watch his responses. Don't worry if he doesn't come to you, just keep leaving treats.
If he learns beak-first towards the treat but doesn't move his feet, he may want you to bring it closer. If he leans away from you, you are too close.

Please let me know what he does.
questionare
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by questionare »

Thanks alot for the valuable feedback.

I will start with your advise and see how this goes... Do you advise working with him while inside cage, or to have him on a stand?


Also, any indications on age,sex, mutation?

Thanks
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by InTheAir »

You can work with the bird wherever he is comfortable. Just make sure you always give him room to get away from you if he wants to.

I don't really know much about colour mutations. You could try taking some clearer photos in natural lighting and someone else might have an idea. If your bird is under 2 or 3 years old it is pretty hard to tell what sex it is unless you have him dna or surgically sexed. Age is hard to tell too.
questionare
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by questionare »

Today I placed several types of food in the bowl, and recorded the IRN while eating it; to find his favorite food, and as usual, it was sunflower seed, and he picked the seed before eating the fruit or veggies.

I will remove the sunflower seed from his daily diet, but the issue, is that the bird is always on the run, even inside the cage, so he won't accept eating from my hand, I may start putting sunflower seeds in front of him, hopefully gradually he will come closer, but I think it is a long way; since seems he is afraid from human, even though he is a hand raised one.
MissK
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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by MissK »

I would doubt that it's going to take so long for your bird, provided you build your relationship solidly and take care not to offend him.
-MissK
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by InTheAir »

See, they always go for the most unhealthy thing!

Parrots can recognise different people. My hen is perfectly friendly with me and my boyfriend, but will scream and fly away if a stranger walks up to her like we do. Ringnecks are renowned for being shy.

It can take time to make friends with a bird. Don't try to rush.
Will he come eat treats when you are standing near the bowl?
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by MissK »

I wonder if the bird isn't at least partially content to sit on the hand? Am I correct reading this that he could fly away but will sit on the hand unless there is a perch available? Or is it the case that the hand is the most familiar thing in the room?

I'm also wondering how it would go if the bird were sitting on a perch and a sunflower seed were placed on the hand and the hand offered at or below perch level.
-MissK
questionare
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by questionare »

InTheAir wrote: Will he come eat treats when you are standing near the bowl?
No, he won't eat if I am.close.to.the cage, he eats.once I.am.away
MissK wrote:I wonder if the bird isn't at least partially content to sit on the hand? Am I correct reading this that he could fly away but will sit on the hand unless there is a perch available? Or is it the case that the hand is the most familiar thing in the room?

I'm also wondering how it would go if the bird were sitting on a perch and a sunflower seed were placed on the hand and the hand offered at or below perch level.
The bird would set.on hand, but will always search for something to fly to, be it a cage, perch, chair.

He would eat from my hand only if he is on a perch, and didn't find a place to fly to

Thanks
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by MissK »

Being me, I'm going to focus on "he would eat from my hand if he were on the perch and didn't find a place to fly away". If he would eat from your hand in any situation, that pleases me (settle down Claire) because it tells me he understands eating from your hand. Nice!

I'm sure Claire already told you this, but I haven't been paying *closest* attention, and this is my customization of the idea:

Let the bird out to that perch he likes so much so you can mess around in the cage without upsetting him.
Open the door and place a perch in a spot that would make it easy for the bird to sit there and reach to your hand if you just put it slightly in through the open door. Make the perch as high as you can and still allow enough room for a bird to go from the perch to your hand to out of the cage (and the same in reverse) comfortably. I found that situation to be very useful, and you won't have to change things when (if) you start bringing the bird in and out of the cage on your hand.

Now place a food cup where the perch mounts to the cage in such a way you can drop a treat into it through the bars or by reaching just slightly into the cage.

With your food cup and perch set this way, you can start dropping the treat in the cup and walking away as Claire surely suggested. You can also, when the time is right, stand by the cage eating treats yourself and dropping them into the cup as well. Don't stand close until the bird will tolerate it, but eventually you will be able to stand there and share a meal of treats, and that is a wonderful thing on it's own, but it will help build that acceptance from your bird. I've been placing treats for my shy bird, Sinbad, and he comes to take them as I stand near. Sometimes he is too eager and takes them from my fingers before I let them go if I move slowly. It should be noted that Sinbad has recently got some extra incentive to hurry up and take the treat because his friend Rocky is very quick to hustle over and steal that treat. I think that helps just the tiniest bit. Sinbad is not yet able to tolerate my hand going towards him if my hand is also inside the cage, but my next goal is for him to approach the treat cup before my hand completely leaves the cage. Life is busy, so this will take a long time for me, but for someone more attentive, would likely not take so long, especially in a previously tame bird.

Claire, note this - when I hear the bird used to lie on his back and accept head pets, and accepts head pets now when "stranded" on the hand, I am wondering do you think he was previously trained with flooding and learned helplessness? And when I think that, I wonder if there are any danger areas where he might not react as expected to how we might train a "normal" bird. On the one hand, I feel all living things respond to operant conditioning, but on the other hand, I feel thinking creatures many times interpret stimuli under the influence of what is already learned. SO, is there any thinking that there should be a special approach to training the bird that previously learned helplessness? (Let me just drop that complicated note and go sip my coffee........) :D
-MissK
MissK
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Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by MissK »

Oh, and somewhat late, Questionare, you have a pretty bird! Do his chest feathers usually lie flat and smooth or are they usually slightly messed up as pictured?
-MissK
questionare
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat Nov 07, 2015 2:58 pm

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by questionare »

MissK wrote:Being me, I'm going to focus on "he would eat from my hand if he were on the perch and didn't find a place to fly away". If he would eat from your hand in any situation, that pleases me (settle down Claire) because it tells me he understands eating from your hand. Nice!

I'm sure Claire already told you this, but I haven't been paying *closest* attention, and this is my customization of the idea:

Let the bird out to that perch he likes so much so you can mess around in the cage without upsetting him.
Open the door and place a perch in a spot that would make it easy for the bird to sit there and reach to your hand if you just put it slightly in through the open door. Make the perch as high as you can and still allow enough room for a bird to go from the perch to your hand to out of the cage (and the same in reverse) comfortably. I found that situation to be very useful, and you won't have to change things when (if) you start bringing the bird in and out of the cage on your hand.

Now place a food cup where the perch mounts to the cage in such a way you can drop a treat into it through the bars or by reaching just slightly into the cage.

With your food cup and perch set this way, you can start dropping the treat in the cup and walking away as Claire surely suggested. You can also, when the time is right, stand by the cage eating treats yourself and dropping them into the cup as well. Don't stand close until the bird will tolerate it, but eventually you will be able to stand there and share a meal of treats, and that is a wonderful thing on it's own, but it will help build that acceptance from your bird. I've been placing treats for my shy bird, Sinbad, and he comes to take them as I stand near. Sometimes he is too eager and takes them from my fingers before I let them go if I move slowly. It should be noted that Sinbad has recently got some extra incentive to hurry up and take the treat because his friend Rocky is very quick to hustle over and steal that treat. I think that helps just the tiniest bit. Sinbad is not yet able to tolerate my hand going towards him if my hand is also inside the cage, but my next goal is for him to approach the treat cup before my hand completely leaves the cage. Life is busy, so this will take a long time for me, but for someone more attentive, would likely not take so long, especially in a previously tame bird.

Claire, note this - when I hear the bird used to lie on his back and accept head pets, and accepts head pets now when "stranded" on the hand, I am wondering do you think he was previously trained with flooding and learned helplessness? And when I think that, I wonder if there are any danger areas where he might not react as expected to how we might train a "normal" bird. On the one hand, I feel all living things respond to operant conditioning, but on the other hand, I feel thinking creatures many times interpret stimuli under the influence of what is already learned. SO, is there any thinking that there should be a special approach to training the bird that previously learned helplessness? (Let me just drop that complicated note and go sip my coffee........) :D
Thanks MissK;

Now I put the IRN on a high stand (almost shoulder level), and have a cup attached to it, I now move beside him, while he is cautious, but won't fly. I feed him from my hand; while I am not that close, and I place treats in the cup and move away. He is accepting me more than before, but still cautious.
MissK wrote:Oh, and somewhat late, Questionare, you have a pretty bird! Do his chest feathers usually lie flat and smooth or are they usually slightly messed up as pictured?
his feathers are somehow flat and smooth, except a single sport where the feather are slightly missed up, do you suspect plucking? I purchased the bird like this.
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: Retaming a hand-raised IRN

Post by MissK »

No, if the bird were plucking you would know. I just feel that some people have had birds who manipulate the feathers in this area. I think it should be monitored in case there is any increase in the attention the bird pays to this spot. I rejected a bird, in part, for feathers that were curled in that area because I didn't want to chance it was paying too much attention to that area. Plucking bothers me, perhaps, more than others, so i could not take that chance.

Your bird's feathers might just be fluffed up for the photo, or they could be funky to lie that way, or the bird could be manipulating them. Not to worry. I was just interested.
-MissK
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