dominant or recessive

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samtheman
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dominant or recessive

Post by samtheman »

hey there i wish to purchase a pied ringneck, how can i tell which is pied and which is dominant and which of the two can i breed with let say a violet and still get piers??
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Hi,

Ask the breeder if the pied is Dom. or Rec.

If dominant you can pair it to Violet and about 50% offspring will be pieds.

In Aus. there's only Dom. Pieds available in other countries will be diff. types of pieds as well.



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samtheman
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by samtheman »

ok just incase are there any visual ways that i could be able to tell myself and also if i pair it with any other colour will the babies be 50% pied of the colour i pair with ?
rickyc
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by rickyc »

If you pair a dominant pied to any colour you will get 50 0/0 dompied 50 o/o other colour whichever you pair with
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Hi, I am new to this but I have a question. Can recessive pied babies if not showing pied be split to pied.
Thank you :?:
madas
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by madas »

Ring0Neck wrote: In Aus. there's only Dom. Pieds available
This isn't correct at all. ;)
I know two kinds of rec. pieds in OZ. :D

madas
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Thank you for your comments. If there are two different recessive pieds could you explain the differences and how they were breed. Why I ask is because I have what I think is a recessive pied. I have asked some breeds but they say they don't know what she is.
Cheers.
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

I will try to post some photos. I am very new at this but I will try. I was given the blue male. I think he was to loud for the other people. I bought the hen from a pet shop they said she was par blue what ever that is but she is a very pretty bird.
when I bought her she was white with some light blue dots on her wings and neck not a lot of dots but you could notice them clearly. She has turned out to be a blue lacewing. Last season this pair had two blue males and this hen who is blue with very bright white sploches on her wings and head. She has light grey coloured feet and nails and a red beak.
Thank you for helping.
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Hi, Every one here in Australia keeps telling me there are no recessive pieds here. If there are recessive pieds in Australia where are they :?: :?
Thank you.
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

There are a couple of breeders that could have them but i highly doubt anyone has any for sale.
I certainly haven't seen any advertised yet.
even if they were available, they would cost as much as a new car ;)
madas wrote:
Ring0Neck wrote: In Aus. there's only Dom. Pieds available
This isn't correct at all. ;)
I know two kinds of rec. pieds in OZ. :D

madas
Madas, I said available by which i mean for sale
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shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

That means that my bird can't be a recessive pied if thats the case. One breeder called her a pied then a funny looking lacewing but she has a blue head. Still trying to send photos.
Cheers.
madas
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by madas »

Ring0Neck wrote: Madas, I said available by which i mean for sale
Upsi. I thought you ment not exist. :)
Sorry then.

To clarify with rec. pied i don't mean ADM rec. pied from USA or SA. :)

madas
madas
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by madas »

shoshan wrote:That means that my bird can't be a recessive pied if thats the case. One breeder called her a pied then a funny looking lacewing but she has a blue head. Still trying to send photos.
Cheers.
Hi,

even bad marked ADM rec. pied are showing a yellow resp. white spot on the head. So no spot no ADM rec. pied.

madas
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Most likely not.

Look at this website, see if you can see a bird that looks similar to yours.

http://psittacula-world.com/EN/Mutation ... Pallid.htm

otherwise you can email the pics to me to upload here
Last edited by Ring0Neck on Wed Apr 09, 2014 3:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

I looked at the website she is not there. She has a blue head with white on the back of the head. I thought after her molt she would even out but that is not the case. She has a mottled blue and white chest and the white markings are more noticeable on her back and wings but her bace colour is Blue.
Gratz
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Gratz »

Hi Shoshan
is her head anything like this?
regards
Gratz
Image
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Not as much white but close. I'm sorry every one I'm still working on the photo thing.
Thanks
Gratz
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Gratz »

Ok
the pic I posted is a Dom pied (mother pastel violet pied , Father deep blue)
ie only one pied needed to reproduce pieds
hope this helps
regards
Gratz
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Ring0Neck, I have found a photo on indian ringneck Victoria it is photo 4. My bird has a blue head but the markings on the wings are close. On a sad note I'm begining to think she is not a pied but what :?: :roll:
I'v been trying to send an email but it keeps coming back i must be doing some thing wrong.
Cheers
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

shoshan's pics
These photos are the same bird taken with different cameras. I took them when she was going through a molt, I thought she would change but she didn't. The middle photo is her colour.
http://parakeet.me/irn/f/c/bell.jpg


EDIT: added another pic (last pic is the mother hen)

http://parakeet.me/irn/f/c/bell2.jpg

I tend to think the Blue (Father) is in fact an Edged /Cinnamon and perhaps Misty from the hen???
hen possibly being a blue pallid misty????
I have not seen the father's pics as yet just guessing based on above pics.

shoshan said in regards to the mother hen:
when I bought her she was white with some light blue dots on her wings and neck not a lot of dots but you could notice them clearly. She has turned out to be a blue lacewing. Last season this pair had two blue males and this hen who is blue with very bright white sploches on her wings and head.
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sheyd
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by sheyd »

Ben you think misty for everything :lol: Hen looks like a normal Pallid to me.

I have seen a similar bird- was a combo of Pallid or Pied (can't remember as I can't find it now) and SL Edged. Looked the same but was in Violet- very striking
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

sheyd wrote:Ben you think misty for everything :lol: Hen looks like a normal Pallid to me.

...
Sure i do

I bet that i can show you or most other OZ breeders a blue misty as a normal blue & no one will ever pick it as misty.
So, how do you expect to see misty in a pallid? what difference do you think a misty pallid would have that the one in the pic does not?

I do not see misty in the pallid bird either, it is however a possible reason why the bird was white when young.
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sheyd
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by sheyd »

well okay then.. every second bird :lol:


I'd love you to show me a Blue Misty here in Oz, that is genuinely like the Misty's o/s-- Got one?

It has also been pointed out before, that Misty doesn't cause whiteness.
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Hi All, I have taken some photo of the father of my baby. I thought he was just a blue boy but when I looked at the photo there was grey and white is this normal for a blue bird :?:
Cheers
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Ring0Neck wrote:...

I tend to think the Blue (Father) is in fact an Edged /Cinnamon and perhaps Misty from the hen???
hen possibly being a blue pallid misty????
I have not seen the father's pics as yet just guessing based on above pics.

...
Picture of the father from shoshan
clearly a Blue edged

& possibly MISTY :lol: as well looking at the third shot

http://parakeet.me/irn/m/em/blueringneck2.jpeg

Misty doesn't cause whiteness


that means that it is not a diluting mutation.
but we are talking combo mutations here of 3+ or even DF


this what Deon had to say on a diff thread RE Misty:
Deon Smith wrote:Lee said:
Deon based on Madas statement that the ground color is "a step" darker your suggestion appears contradictory.
my experience with misty is that this mutation lightens green and blue
I don't think we can describe this mutation in conventional terms of paleness or darkness, as iridescence enters, as I have wrapped up in my book; probably due to structural change in the cortex.
We must see the colour effects in another dimension. My impression in shade is of a milky overlay, giving it an aqua-like appearance.

...

Deon
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Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Shoshan

what can be sure is that your mature pair is
Blue SL Dominant Edged & Blue Pallid (Lacewing) hen
young is Blue SL Dom. Edged being a hen it is much lighter than the father.

other possible mutations can be misty & cinnamon
hard to say from the pics but if the young hen is also cinnamon then the father is split cinnamon
I'm an Explorer
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shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Thank you for all your help every one. I'm thinking of getting a pied male do you think this is the thing to do or would you have any other idea's.
Cheers
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

:D

there are a few breeders doing just that this breeding season, myself included.
we are not sure how that combination would look like.
the offspring could well be white birds (or yellow in green) esp. the hens.
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shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

what colour pied then or would it matter.
thanks
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Turquoise (Pastel) is needed if the offspring is mostly white/yellow it will add a nice color throughout the bird.
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sheyd
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by sheyd »

you said whiten not lighten. anyhow, 'misty' always seems to get 'added' to birds that are of the sl edged mutation- don't know how many times I've counted where breeders thought that Misty was also in an edged bird. I believe edged birds just seem to have a quality that is similar to Misty.

If a 'without a doubt Misty' -no edge was bred from one of these 'misty-erous' edged birds (had to borrow that from you- couldn't resist :D )- then yeah, Misty it is also. Until then I'm not convinced.

(same could also be said about Cinnamon)
.......


Shoshan,
SL Edged to a Dom Pied may not show many characteristics of SL Edged depending on how much melanin is removed from the pied -esp flights where sl edged displays the most. Would be an interesting bird to view anyhow.
Johan S
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Johan S »

Ring0Neck wrote:
sheyd wrote:Ben you think misty for everything :lol: Hen looks like a normal Pallid to me.

...
Sure i do

I bet that i can show you or most other OZ breeders a blue misty as a normal blue & no one will ever pick it as misty.
So, how do you expect to see misty in a pallid? what difference do you think a misty pallid would have that the one in the pic does not?

I do not see misty in the pallid bird either, it is however a possible reason why the bird was white when young.
Ben, that is a very good question. However, those that have been playing with misty combinations report that misty is visible even in albino birds as a soft fawn type overlay over the bird. I haven't seen it in IRN though, but there are reports of such an alexandrine. What I have seen is a misty opaline, and you can very clearly pic out the difference between a misty blue opaline and a normal blue opaline. Misty tends to lighten it and give a chrome/steel type of colour to the bird. But I'm not going to get too outspoken about the topic, as I am convinced there is a puzzle in the misty world too. I'm sure there are at least two different phenotypes at play, and that could be different alleles or mutations altogether. It deserves a topic of it's own, though.
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

Ben, that is a very good question. However, those that have been playing with misty combinations report that misty is visible even in albino birds as a soft fawn type overlay over the bird...
I agree, i think it can be seen in INO birds, hence my "yellow" hen i suspect misty is paired to a lutino for this season.
quiet dissapointed that so little is known about misty, although i understand breeders not wanting to spend time working on a mutation that is barely visible in most colors.
In pallid however, unless you know its there i doubt it'll be easy to ID.

Shey

Nobody is convinced, breeding results is the only way to prove either way.
I'm an Explorer
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sheyd
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by sheyd »

Ring0Neck wrote: In pallid however, unless you know its there i doubt it'll be easy to ID.
Markus Erhenbrink had some photos of his Misty Blue Pallid hen- it was washed in grey.
Nobody is convinced, breeding results is the only way to prove either way.
exactly.
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

| Hi All, I would like know what a Rainbow ringneck is. :|
thanks
sheyd
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by sheyd »

a 'rainbow' is nothing more than a TurquoiseBlue Pallid. People come up with fancy names to make the bird sound more appealing.
shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

So You can just call your bird what every you thank. :shock: Then how do you know what your buying.
Ring0Neck
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by Ring0Neck »

shoshan wrote:So You can just call your bird what every you thank. :shock: Then how do you know what your buying.
No.

Let's call them "street names" or "name describing visual appearance" or "to shorten a genetical rumble" or simply nicknames.

A nickname is used in non genetical terms to describe a mutation or a combination of mutations.
example: nickname Lavender = genetical name Cinnamon Violet Blue

Rainbow = TurquoiseBlue Pallid

Lacewing is the old name for Pallid
Pastel = old & wrong name for Turquoise

so creating names out of the blue is not on, although others mainly handraisers who do not have much knowledge in genetics would makeup names like "Lime" because they're trying to describe what they see.



etc
I'm an Explorer
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shoshan
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Re: dominant or recessive

Post by shoshan »

Hi all. I have put myself in it again. I have purchased a violet pied male that will go to my blue female. I also purchased a Creamino hen but I was told not to breed her with a Lutino male
Question is WHY. :?: :?
thanks
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