Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

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LadyMostTimes
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Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by LadyMostTimes »

2 yrs ago I was given a blue IRN. I am her 4th owner and no matter how mean she is, I will be her last owner. When I first got her she brought blood every time I changed her food and water. She would bite and not let go sometimes. She brought blood every day for months. I can't stand having a pet that stays locked up so every morning I would open her cage and let her out. At night I would use a towel to put her back in cage. My son in law worked with her as much as I did and she became friends with him. He could pet her and she would get off her cage and walk over to him. Me, she attacks!! I have noticed she loves men. But it's normally only me and 2 dogs and and Makayla, AKA Miss Mean. When she is on flooor she will jump in my hands and as long as I'm not near her cage she will let me love on her. But still attacks when she is on or in her cage. I give her attention on regular basis. I keep her in the living room so she is not alone. She hates being alone. Please is there any hope for this unhappy little bird? I hate being bit all the time but I hate her being so unhappy even more. She is a good eater I give her a big variety of food. She always has clean water and clean cage. She will take food out of my hand most of the time but there are times she acts like she is gonna take the food but bites my finger instead. What do I do! Giving her away is not an option. She has been passed around to much already so she is mine for life. Please help me.
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shanc21
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by shanc21 »

Hi,

I am not an expert by any means, but I think it is never too late. I think your attitude towards giving her a home no matter what is great. I have an IRN that is a rescue - she was escaped or let go and I found her outside and was able to catch her. She was scared and nippy and not tame in the beginning. But she also was/is so terribly curious and intelligent. I have no idea how old she is since I don't know her history, and she may well be quite a young bird (though old enough to have adult coloring), but she has made a lot of progress becoming more tame - at least with me. She is still loud and nippy with others - the more I've gotten to know her, I think it is fear that promotes these behaviors with others. I suspect it's to do with whatever treatment she received before I found her.

You probably know these things, but I would just try to focus on positive reinforcement for desired behaviors - and not reinforcing the biting and other negative behaviors, which sometimes you can do inadvertently without realizing it - so trying to figure out why she bites is important and sometimes tricky. Consistency and patience and paying close attention to what she responds to - because they are all individuals and are intelligent - is what it takes.

Maybe try teaching her to step up on a stick, instead of your hand, until she is more trustworthy with biting. Does she have a food/treat she especially likes - if so, only give it when working on training her - as a reward for stepping up on the stick. Do you know what she gets out of the biting - why is it reinforcing to her - i.e. is for control, is it to get a reaction out of you, is it to make you put her down, is it territorial/defensive. If you can analyze and figure stuff like that out, you can begin to think how to manipulate the situation to where she will have less need to bite and/or not get the same effect out of it and so choose to stop.

If you can train her to step up on the stick reliably, that can become a distraction to interrupt biting behavior if you sense it is about to happen - present the stick, and if the step up is automatic, she will step up on it and hopefully forget about the bite, at least in that moment. You can then reward her with a treat. Progress is a moment by moment thing. Celebrate any small gain and try to build on it. If she does bite, it's hard but try not to react - if part of her motivation is to get a response, this will help diminish the behavior. If you know she loves attention, immediately withdraw attention as well. For example, if she bites - don't yell or react (if possible) but immediately put her down and turn your back.

I used these techniques for biting and for making loud angry raucous calls that I think were attention seeking. And it was slow but definately decreased these behaviors. For Neela, pistachios were the treat I used to reinforce. She loves them. When she made the raucous noise, I would look away until she was stopped it and only when quiet or when she was making a sweeter noise, look at her and talk to her and give attention - so hopefully she learned that the loud noise did not bring her attention, but quieter or sweet noises did. She also hates not getting attention, so if I ever put her down and turned my back on her for biting, after a few seconds, she would usually make a sweet initiating call seeking attention - I would reinforce that by looking at her and talking to her again.

If she is biting getting in and out of the cage, I would definately try having her step on a stick to put her in and out. Once you have a successful getting in or out using a stick with no biting, definately give a reinforcer immediately. Neela would take a pistachio from my fingers, but would bite when it was offered on an open hand for the longest time. A lot of the work was just offering the nut in my hand and waiting for her to work up the courage to come close and get it without biting. then she got to where she would step on my arm instead of the stick and would even climb up my leg if I was sitting in a chair and sit on my knee, but would still freak and bite if offered my hand to step up on. It was just a slow gradual process.

I also read a bit about clicker training and tried that a little bit too in the beginning. I would put a stick in the cage and when she touched or bit it, I would click the clicker and give her a treat. The idea was that if she was reinforced to touch the stick wherever it was placed, then you could use it to lead her places you needed her to go - like out of the cage at the vet's office. So I would do it 4 or 5 times making her move from one side of the cage to the other to practice, and she got very responsive to it. Having some responses like this trained in connection with you just seems to help her accept other training from you too. Although I have not kept this up once she became able to step up on my hand which she does now. I probably should have. Going to the vet is still a big problem. She is so scared with other people still. I am always shocked - I forget because she has made such progress with me.

You may have tried all these sorts of things; I know they are all different and don't all respond the same, but I wish you luck for you and Makayla's sake. I am a special ed teacher so I am used to trying to solve problems and I do believe it is never too late to help them change if you can figure out what makes them tick. Parrots with behavior problems are not that different from SPED kids. Good Luck!
sanjays mummi
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by sanjays mummi »

Two things spring to mind, fear (angst biting) and territorial, because from what I gather, she is more feisty when you put your hands inside her cage, I don't believe it is too late, because, despite the old saying, one Can teach an old dog new tricks, I've done it!.
I agree that she may have been mishandled in the past, rescued animals always display behaviour they have learned from past experiences, for territorial, I would suggest changing her accoutrements around, and possibly cage location every so often, the fear biting should abate once she has properly bonded with you, the most I ever get is a gentle nibble if I inadvertently upset my bird, bear in mind too, parrots as a species are fickle, they tend to turn on a sixpence as we say here in the UK, tickles one minute then telling us to back off the next.
LadyMostTimes
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by LadyMostTimes »

Shanx21. Thank so so much for advice. I will use stick when she is on her cage. When she is on floor I can pick her up took forever to do but she jumps on my hand by command. I am then able to love on her kiss on her and carry her anywhere just as long as she is up against my chest and I have her cupped in my hands Once she is near her Cage tho she wriggles and fights to get back on her cage. Those angry raucous noises I have been rewarding. Ugh now I have to start over. No matter I wasn't getting any positive results anyway. I love that advise and will work on it
The biting I have been going about it all wrong. She bites I talk sternly with her and will give her lectures at time. Works great with my dogs. lol I never have to raise my voice with them the sternness works great. But I will ignore her bites. Thank you so much. My family hates this poor little bird because she has hurt me so many times. They don't think there is any hope for her. I know there're is. She has come a very far way so far and it's my fault she still bites and screams. Once again. Thank you so very muc
:-bd :o3

What? A bird site and no bird smilies.? :-?
LadyMostTimes
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by LadyMostTimes »

Shanc21. Thank so so much for advice. I will use stick when she is on her cage. When she is on floor I can pick her up took forever to do but she jumps on my hand by command. I am then able to love on her kiss on her and carry her anywhere just as long as she is up against my chest and I have her cupped in my hands Once she is near her Cage tho she wriggles and fights to get back on her cage. Those angry raucous noises I have been rewarding. Ugh now I have to start over. No matter I wasn't getting any positive results anyway. I love that advise and will work on it
The biting I have been going about it all wrong. She bites I talk sternly with her and will give her lectures at time. Works great with my dogs. lol I never have to raise my voice with them the sternness works great. But I will ignore her bites. Thank you so much. My family hates this poor little bird because she has hurt me so many times. They don't think there is any hope for her. I know there're is. She has come a very far way so far and it's my fault she still bites and screams. Once again. Thank you so very much
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What? A bird site and no bird smilies.? :-?
LadyMostTimes
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by LadyMostTimes »

sanjays mummI

Thank you for help. Yes she is very territorial. If she wants it and likes it she claims ownership. When she got on floor she loved my shoes and go straight for them. As soon as I came close head went down wings back and she attacks my toes. Ahhhh so painful But no matter what she claims I can't even walk by her. At least I can go by when she is on cage
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What? A bird site and no bird smilies.? :-?
AJPeter
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by AJPeter »

I hate the idea of training my bird to beg like a dog with a biscuit on her nose, and l do not go for positive re-enforcement, although other people swear by it, and as for biting , my hen knows l yell and show her the blood mostly she bites without thinking and is sorry after. She is a rescued bird with at least two other owners and was about 4 years old and l have had her for three years. her previous owner put her out of an upstairs window because she attacked his canaries. Billie will step up when she wants to, even on my hand but mostly l use an old perch. I have to wait for her to go to the top of the cage to remove something from the grid, it is her cage and she wants me to understand that she is training me to behave the way she wants but it takes time and patience to train her to do things my way. Biting is the quick way, patience is the slow way. One day we will get it right.
LadyMostTimes
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Re: Can 12 yr old IRN be trained to stop biting?

Post by LadyMostTimes »

I don't " yell" at my animals st all unless of course they are outside and I yell for them to come in. I've had Makayla 2 yrs and showing I am upset with her has not worked so far. I will most definitely try the ignore approach.
Thank you for your opinion
:-bd :o3

What? A bird site and no bird smilies.? :-?
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