Choosing a New Cage

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InTheAir
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by InTheAir »

I very much doubt that leaving him in the cage for a few days will make him like it more. I very much disliked brussel sprouts when I was a child, but was made to eat them anyway. Now I absolutely hate them and haven't even tried them as an adult. I also disliked mushrooms as a child and was told I could pick them out of my meals so I didn't have to eat them. I love them now.

When Nila went through a little phase of not wanting to be in his cage, my boyfriend and I realised we had to make his cage a treat (our guys are out of their cages most of the day every day). He loves foraging, so we would set a heap of toys and puzzles up and show him they were there and he'd go straight in to play. We left the doors open, so he knew he could leave if he wanted to. His attitude to his cage changed quickly. It was never hard to get him into his cage, it was just that he wanted to come out immediately.

Sapphire was harder to get into her cage in the first place, if she didn't want to go there, so we employed the same method plus she gets a treat when she goes into the cage and a treat after the door is closed, plus fun foraging and whatever foot toy she is obsessing over to keep her occupied. She will go in her cage to play or nap now and chews foot toys or perches when she's stuck in there, though she prefers Nilas cage!


Btw I'm thinking of buying Sapphire a new cage, hers was meant to be temporary as we had hoped that she'd move in with Nila. That is not going to happen in the foreseeable future so I'm considering this http://m.ebay.com.au/itm/221357905186
That seems to be the biggest I can afford that has a suitable bar spacing. I thought she may enjoy the shape too. I hate the seed skirt, I'm hoping it's removable!

What do you guys think of it?
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Donovan ~ If he is tied to the old cage you might try placing it inside the new cage and then take it apart over time.

Claire ~ That's a pretty exciting cage. Dave not up for more carpentry?
Better buy some shin guards if you can't get that seed skirt off!
-MissK
AJPeter
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by AJPeter »

When l first got Billie the cage came too, it was big and awkward to move so when l got the new cage it was a lot smaller the bowls were very small but the cage was on wheels, after l asembled the new cage l asked Billie to look inside and quickly put the old one out into the hall.
I have no idea whether she missed it but there was no problem with the new cage she loved the openning top and of a night time she goes in at the right time, when she became hormonal last year and was looking for a nest site l kept her in when l went out of the house, but today l want shopping and left her out she stayed on the outside of the cage all the time l was out of the house about two hours.
So when choosing a new cage, considerations of space, locality, ease of use and cleaning must come high up on the list of what cage to buy.
InTheAir
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by InTheAir »

MissK wrote:
Claire ~ That's a pretty exciting cage. Dave not up for more carpentry?
Better buy some shin guards if you can't get that seed skirt off!
Dave did suggest the carpentry option, but I pointed out that he said he never wanted to do it again when we finished the last one. :lol: Nilas cage did end up costing atleast as much as that one, possibly a bit more. Though I do find his cage so easy to clean, that's got to be worth the money and days spent building it.
If the seed skirt is not detachable, we have a hack saw or grinder that will modify it to suit us.
AJPeter
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by AJPeter »

I was thinking Claire that the seed catcher is also a poop catcher with a flat top would Nila stand on the top and poop over the edge? It is a remarkable low price, with wheels it will be easy to clean under and around the cage.
Donovan
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Donovan »

Alright, so tonight instead of giving Mr. Bell his supper in a little plate on top of his old cage I put it in the food bowl of the new cage. After protesting a bit he went in and I shut the door on him. He immediately lost interest in the food and just wanted out. I messed up and didn't wait on him to actually start eating so there was no real reward factor.

So he paced around back and forth in the cage. So i figured out he was happy enough to take his favorite treat which is peanuts through the bars, so i gave him bite after bite of peanut through the bars, then I let him back out of the cage and moved the food bowl to a place he felt safe.

I think this is the right method for getting him into that cage. Just brief sessions full of all his favorite foods. And no I didn't deprive him of food before hand. He is just always anxious for his plate of real food every night.

I'll do it again tomorrow but next time i'll wait until he starts actually eating the food before shutting him in. Or should I not be shutting the door on him at all?


And btw, InTheAir, that's an awesome cage. Have you ordered it already or still considering?
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

I think I would try this:
food in
bird in
high value treat in
door stays open

for a while, until he is ok to go in and out on his own. Then I would go:
food in
bird in
shut door
high value treat in
open door

for a while, and then I would go to
food in
bird in
shut door
high value treat in
open door
high value treat in
shut door
high value treat in
open door
etc

and then just increase the amount of time the door is shut as well as randomize if it opens right away or stays shut longer.
If the bird shows distress at the door being shut, then you went too fast. Of course, being used to a lot of freedom, as he is, Bell may not appreciate being shut in at all, but if you let him build up to it you might be able to head off immediately and firmly hating the cage. At least, I hope that's how it will go!!
-MissK
InTheAir
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by InTheAir »

I think you should do what missk says.


I haven't decided on a cage yet, that was the best option so far. Why are bird cages all so small, unless they have massive gaps between bars? It's silly.
Donovan
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Donovan »

conditioning mr bell to the new cage (new cage A) is going well enough..... so yesterday I received another cage (new cage B) FedEx.... Today while putting it together I had the little bag of nuts and bolts on the floor next to me.. Mr Bell was extremely interested in what I was doing. He flew down to the floor and attempted to steal the little bag of nuts and bolts. He managed to fly with it a little, just enough to dump out all the hardware much of which fell into an air vent in the floor... good times.. luckily i retrieved everything.
Was this sabotage? :P
Last edited by Donovan on Sat Mar 22, 2014 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Hahaha!

Now you have to get him his own stainless steel bolt with nuts to play with!
-MissK
AJPeter
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by AJPeter »

That's life! InTheAir l buy a shirt 18 collar size but the shirt arms are taliored for a gorilla. Big gaps big bird.
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

Hello...I have been very interested in this thread as I have been considering new cages for my birds. Their current homes are above MissK's recommendations & I am not rich but they are only 4yrs so any cage is going to last them a long time. MissK I have looked - on line - and your double flight is one I have almost ordered several times. Any cons? Is there any difference between this and the double wide A&E cage? I have read the HQ is made by King, any knowledge of this? Any problems with the powder coating over time? I sometimes think I should wait & buy the anodized aluminum. Do you think the added expense is worth it? Anybody have experience with this material?
If you could go bigger, what would you consider? I have the IRN & a sun conure. They are usually housed together but I am keeping a close out out for any change in interactions because of hormones/maturity etc.

IntheAir - Claire? - I like that cage but are corner cages of any concern? Anyone?

Also, not sure if I saw the recommended bar spacing???? I have read 3/4" is sometimes too big for some ringnecks. I have been trying to find 5/8". My current cages are 5/8", but I think the bars themselves are too thin/flimsy - and my sun conure is becoming a bar chewer. I do not care if it supposed to be non-toxic. I do not want him ingesting anything that is not proper food.

I have considered making cages but I cannot believe how many 'aviary panels' that are sold are made out of galvanized aluminum???? It seems to me this should be illegal. This is toxic right - hot dipped or not?

Mary
Mary
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Mary, someplace I think I made a post about my cage for SkyesCrew, in which I mentioned the drawbacks I could imagine. They are not huge in my daily life, as you might imagine, or else I would be complaining. Only thing I can think of right now is 1) the place on the bottom where the divider would go gets messy and is a tad hard to clean and 2) only the main doors have locks. I saw fit to "lock" them with various devices.

I don't know the difference between makers of look-alikes. I think I would probably not notice much difference in person either. I don't know about the relationship of various cage makers, either. I can say my cages are looking 100% brand new, with regards to the finish. They are, what, like two years old? I can say I remain unfavourably impressed with Prevue-Hendryx products. Hendryx was top notch in my mother's day, not so much now.

ALSO, very important distinction, while I have stated my opinions on the smallest cage reasonable for IRN, I do not in any way truly recommend an IRN should be kept in a cage smaller than mine. I really don't. I just feel to go smaller than maybe 24" square is clear abuse, and 24" square is no prize either. It's just that when you tell a person they need to use a cage that is exponentially bigger than what they want to use, they frequently close their mind and decide to just go with what they have since they are not going to go with the biggest. Suggesting something more mainstream people will accept, in my opinion, upgrades birds literally to something they can live with. Compromise. A bird in a cage that small has got to come out a lot. Heck, a bird in a cage the size of mine has to come out a lot, too. Just, that's the biggest I could go at the time. At the same time, I feel it is essential that the bird be caged for a length of time each day - not just left to roam the house - so it can retain the skill of living in a cage. Ability to live in a cage is essential sometimes, as life throws us curves, and also in the event of us having to rehome the bird. I feel that I am *very* flexible in accommodating the needs of pets, and even I was shy to take on a bird who lived uncaged. If you really knew me, that would say a lot more to you.

If I were going to get a larger cage I might consider the version of this cage that is taller - and more than twice the price. Other than that, I would be looking into building something myself, or maybe hiring a better carpenter to do it for me. In general I am wanting a larger front-to-back size and I think this is where custom looks necessary. If I were going to ask a cage maker to build one with the smaller bar space just for me, might as well go whole hog and build my dream cage, you know?

The "dream cage" for me would be building in a space in my house ten feet long, four feet deep, and ceiling high. That's the space I have available. The other option would be just bird-proofing the spare bedroom and changing the door for a screen door, letting him roam or be in a living room cage when I'm home and putting in the bedroom there while I work. However, I don't see anything like that happening any time soon, especially since he *can't* be housed with my other birds.

I could express still more opinions, but gotta go to work now. :lol:
-MissK
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

MissK...work? You mean that other thing we do so we can spend money on the birds?

I'll look for the other post. I understood what you meant about size and where you are coming from. My hat's off to you moderators and your need for diplomacy etc especially when the written word, and an occasional picture, is all you have to relate an idea...which may not always be what someone wants to hear.

Your ideas for a cage sound like mine. I like the double side by side but my birds do like to climb so I feel it is not tall enough. As most of us have found out, large cages mean larger bar spacing. Still don't think anyone answered that yet - 5/8" or 3/4"? Likely best to use 'common' sense. I prefer to be safer than sorry and go for the 5/8" but with the thicker bars on the larger cages it seems to create such a wall between the birds and the rest of the room. The inside of the cage also appears darker and I do not like that . I would also prefer not to shine a light directly into the cage. I meant to get larger cages long ago, but my birds are out and supervised most of the day - well, I may have been sleeping but we were in the same room together. Luckily, my two have remained buddies and can happily explore inside and outside of each others cages. From what I can tell, and droppings are such a giveaway - hee,hee -they remained on/in the cages unless I was awake and then we interacted on my bed. And that is why I have a difficult time picturing them in a cage all day. At this point, the hope is I will get back to work some day. And although I have left them in the room with the door shut, while I have been away for short periods, I am not comfortable allowing that for an entire day.

I have a split level entry home which means the basement has regular windows and is submerged into the ground about 3.5'. I removed the floor in one room (~12'x15') and gave that to my 7 lovebirds. That space and the ability to fly has enabled some previously very unhappy, poorly socialized, ill tempered birds to become wonderful pets. Of course I removed a large portion of wall and created a window with coated wire so the birds were not isolated from the rest of the living area. I must confess, however, that I am tired of scrubbing the walls and floors. I have considered a steamer but am concerned about aerosolizing 'germs' versus killing them. Hospitals use machines that produce water vapour not steam. The vapour is much hotter. Of course, these machines are more $. So I have been looking at alternate wall coverings. Fiberglass sheets, laminate, tile, acrylic or other plastics. Oh and a floor drain, so of course a water source near by. How nice to be able to walk in and use a hose.

My mortgage is low enough that I could add money for renovations, but I have also considered moving in the next five years. So many decisions with so many things currently up in the air. If anyone has experience creating a room like I have discussed, or a large cage, I would like to hear about it - see picture? After this post I will look for threads regarding the same.

InTheAir - Claire - I tried to find your cage on a US or Canadian site - I am in British Columbia - but could not locate it. I did not see the manufacturer on your link. Would you please provide it?
Mary
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Hi Mary

First, I'm not a Mod - perish the thought! :lol: :lol: :lol: I do strive for live and let live, though I have ruffled a few feathers only once or twice with expressing thoughts maybe some did not want to hear.

If you think your birds will appreciate the climbing space in the extra tall double wide, then by all means, pass the shorter one by. My bird is not the world's greatest fan of climbing, but I still feel he would enjoy the bigger. I wish I could have gotten it for him. Perhaps in a few years, when the money has grown back after my elderly dogs have gone. Elderly dogs do seem to cost a penny or two..... Or maybe I can build him into the side of the living room as I want to do. Unlike you, I don't really plan to sell the house if I can avoid it. YOU should not be customizing the house for birds if you plan to roll out in a few. It'll take some time to plan and execute the modifications, and then when everybody's getting good and settled, you'll move! Don't do that. Better to build something you can take apart and bring with you.

Bars, thickness and spacing- my bars are 3mm. This is the thinnest you should even think of, and while I suspect it's Ringneck proof, there may be some overachievers out there waiting to prove me wrong. Spacing, I think 3/4 might be OK. My spacing is 1/2", and the cage is actually designed for smaller birds. My travel cage, which we have *never* used, has 3/4" bar spacing. Sigh. I guess I'm going to have to put him in there after all, so I can see how it goes. I paid 40 bucks for that thing, so we may as well use it. I've just been using an 18" square cage for travel, since he came home for the first time in it and he already knew it, and it was just easier for me. That travel cage is for emergency. I want everyone to note I am not saying I will train the bird to go in the travel cage. There was some talk of that and I am JUST too lazy, too got other things going on. We'll see if I can get it out of the closet for starters.......
-MissK
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

Hello Miss K - I think I found the post you were referring to - the date is June 25/13 - in it you wrote "I was surprised to see the stand is actually part of the cage - cannot be removed without disassembling the cage - and part of the structural reinforcement." Really? That is surprising. So I guess you just clean it on the spot. Do you ever disassemble it to really clean those difficult areas and thoroughly disinfect it in the tub.

This is the cage I have been using. http://www.kingscages.com/ProductDetail ... FXL%203221 There are 2 doors but it is not divided.
It is half the size of your cage. 32" wide, 21"deep, Inside height is 35 inches ½ inch bar spacing, 3 mm bar thickness. The top can be lifted off however.

I have considered buying some more and putting them side by side but there would be a space were the stands meet because it extends past the cage edge. Another option would be to build a frame with a melamine back and then use the panels from two cages for sides and the front. The front would consist of the front and back panels. But it hardly seems worth the effort when for not much more I can buy the double wide and still have the original.

I am including a link to your cage for easy ref. http://www.birdscomfort.com/doubleflight_bird_cage.html
I looked for the double flight with extra height but only found Macaw cages with either 1" or 1.2" bare spacing. Would you be able to supply a link to the cage you were referring to?

Have you heard of this company? http://cornerslimited.com/flight.html If you look at the client list it is impressive. But what I do not understand is that all these cage panels are galvanized and therefore toxic. Why would all these places use this product?
Mary
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Hi Mary,

Really quick - I break it down from time to time and wash all the parts in the shower. (Don't tell my mom!) I laughed when you said you read I was surprised and you were surprised to read that and surprised the thing is attached. Maybe someone else will read those previous and be surprised, too. Don't know why I think that's so funny, but I do. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I also have a vacuum that blows like an air compressor if you plug the hose in the other end. That helps, along with the long, skinny attachment for radiators. I read one time that somebody just put something over that space, some plastic or something, and it worked for them. I planned to try that, but, you guessed it, lazy again!

I also had the thought of removing the end panel of both my cages and customizing them into one long one. But, like you, I really want depth and height more , plus Budgies are using that other cage. I don't have a link to the high cage but I'll look over the weekend. My next two days are taken up with doctor stuff and mom stuff.

Don't get any of that galvanized stuff. I read that you could wash it to get the toxic powder off but someone, maybe Melika, advised me that more powder would happen, so it's not really an option. Maybe you could get it and have it powder coated, but I would (if it were me) just rather get the proper stuff to start with. Post in the breeders section for help on building supplies. I think some of them tend to get home brew with their aviaries.

I saw your cage. Once you upgrade you can either sell this cage, use it for a sleep cage, use it for outings to the patio, put it on a different floor of your house, box it for transition during the one-day move to new house, even place it somewhere off site that your bird might visit a lot. For instance, I used to keep a XL dog crate at my mom's house, for when I brought the dogs over. It was really helpful.

I did not chase the last link on the page. Great, now I have like ten minutes to get ready for work. Why do I *DO* this to myself!!
-MissK
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

Hi Miss K...just to be clear...and this may not be...maybe you should make sure you have had some coffee first :wink: I was not surprised that you were surprised, when you discovered the cage portion was attached to the stand. I was surprised, as you were, that the cage is attached to the stand :o [Never noticed this guy before] . Regardless, of why we laugh, IMO, the more reasons you can find to laugh (as long as not at someone else's expense) the healthier you will probably be. Here's to laughing each and every day.

As much as I appreciate you responses, please, please do not feel you need to answer anything I post when you are pressed for time. If I am that concerned that I need an answer 'right now' or if it is an immediate health concern etc, I will call my vet. If I feel it needs immediate attention or they feel it is an emergency, they will allow me to just show up and appreciate the warning I am on my way. And regarding health concerns, I graduated as an Animal Health Technologist. I did the anesthetics, x-rays, minor surgeries at the clinics. I did get some experience with birds at work & combined with my lovebird experience (12yrs + I think) I am pretty comfortable dealing with that side of parrot care. Of course, if I write something that needs to be corrected as it is wrong/dangerous etc, I hope as soon as it is recognized, someone will respond or contact a mod to have it removed.

No worries. I won't buy galvanized. I like the way you can customize your own cages using their panels but what's the point if you are going to kill your bird??? :cry: I was so excited when someone recommended this company. What a disappointment. :( I just find it bizarre to see a lot of their clients are zoos. Their are also some parrot rescues that use their cages although I am not sure they are listed. Things that make you go 'HUH??'
Mary
Melika
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Melika »

MissK wrote:Don't get any of that galvanized stuff. I read that you could wash it to get the toxic powder off but someone, maybe Melika, advised me that more powder would happen...
Right. The powder is simply what happens as it oxidises. Basically it's rust, but in the form of zinc oxide. It isn't considered a danger unless ingested. So if you have birds like finches for example, which do not 'tongue' the bars of the cage, it shouldn't be harmful. If the aviary is such that the parrots rarely if ever feel the need to climb on the side of the cage, I can't see the harm in that either. But it would have to be a VERY large aviary (probably would not fit indoors) for that to happen with a larger parrot.

It's not exactly a common cause of death as far as we know, unless a piece of zinc metal is actually ingested. We just know it can be deadly over time if the toxicity level builds up enough.

Also, before we bash zoos for using them, remember that the cages aren't just for birds. And like I said, for a large enough cage the actual exposure would be limited.
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Donovan
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Donovan »

What are some examples of this potentially toxic bird cage material?
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

Galvanized steel - it's common, actually, steel treated with zinc to prevent rusting. It's that metal with the light, bright, sort of textured finish used for, for example, outdoor feed pans and buckets for livestock. It loses the shiny over time and use. You can probably cruise your local Walmart and find some in the pet dish section. The zinc part is toxic to our birds, and if they ingest enough, they will get poisoned (just like us). I suspect all our pets would suffer from overexposure to zinc. I wish everybody would save their galvanized pans for changing the oil in their car and not for feed or water to pets.

Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanization
close-up image of texture of hot dip galvanized steel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-dip_galvanization
more than you ever cared to know about zinc and humans: http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Zinc-H ... fessional/

My galvanized steel anecdote: Some may know I keep the world's most overindulged pair of mutts. I love them like I love my own blood. Once upon a time I was in the feed store looking for water buckets for these mutts. They only had galvanized buckets, and I knew nothing of galvanized steel. I picked one up and, as I touched it, something in my gut just said "Nope. Not this one. Not for *my* puppies," and so I put it down and shopped elsewhere till I found stainless. That felt right, so I bought two and over a decade later, they are in exactly the same brand new condition as when I got them.
-MissK
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

In my post above I included a link to cornerslimited.com. They use aluminum frames but galvanized aluminum wire. Galvanized aluminum is a dull grey and almost looks powdery. Think of the old metal mop bucket on wheels. They have 36" x 21" x 14" - small breeder cages - they show lovebird's in the cage and they will definitely be climbing. Part of the problem is galvanized zinc will form little globs where the wires intersect - not as bad with hot dipping. Sometimes these break off and are ingested. Other times a point is formed and these points can pierce the bird's skin.

I was not meaning to bash zoos. But I did look through a lot of the site and the zoos often used these cages for holding cages and they were not large cages. They also said they were used for birds. But as MissK mentioned, this stuff is toxic period, and not just to birds or people. It does however need to accumulate, so maybe the zoos use the cages because they are only temporarily used.

My point to MissK was that I loved the idea of these cages, customizing, and how they went together without screws. I was disappointed because they did not meet my needs.
Mary
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Melika »

Sorry, I didn't mean to sound as if I was censuring you. :( Taking things out of context happens a lot on forums, and to people reading, they might think the galvinization industry is horrid and should be stopped- toxic to all! But perhaps they would be forgetting how much waste would be produced with metal rusting so quickly, and how much more pollution and damage to the Earth would occur from the need to produce more metals to replace the ones rusting away. It isn't as if we have an unlimited supply of stainless steel. It is a useful process.

My chicken coop utilises hardware cloth (aka rat-screen) to keep predators out at night. Fortunately I won't have to worry about it rusting away into nothing for a while. The majority of large parrot breeders also use galvanised metal for their rather sizable aviaries. If I built an aviary, I would likely use galvanised. Yes, zinc has been proven to be fatal/toxic. Zinc toxicity seems to be primarily from parts of toys or chips of paint causing a lethal zinc toxicity or the use of galvanised dishes. But from what I can find, galvanised wire has very little to no involvement in these instances- in fact it is more a supposition: "we know zinc can be toxic and can build up over time, so maybe this wire might contribute but we don't actually know because there is no evidence". It is more of a caution. Be informed and make your own decision based on that information.

I did have a thought that since they pride themselves on customisation, they might not be limited to galvanised metals if asked?
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SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

Melika - Gosh no! I did not feel censored at all. I realized you were correct and it would be easy to think that I was possibly bashing zoos without further explanation on my part. And I agree, galvanized metals have a lot of benefits. The problems occur when they are used inappropriately or unknowingly. I considered mentioning zinc on metal chain and snaps etc but decided not to go there last night. Many finch people I know use the hardware cloth for their aviaries for years with no known problems. I have considered it for my finches but will likely use pvc coated wire for its aesthetics. Unless I can find someone who can sell be a few square feet of ss mesh and I would combine it with some plexiglass...all this for the cage I will likely never build. :wink: And if I ever do get chickens, which is not entirely out of the question, I too will likley be using galvanized chicken wire for the coop.

You wrote "...from what I can find, galvanised wire has very little to no involvement in these instances- in fact it is more a supposition: "we know zinc can be toxic and can build up over time, so maybe this wire might contribute but we don't actually know because there is no evidence" " Do you have a link to such articles? I have been tempted to build a long narrow aviary - from GAW or even PVC coasted chain link fence - for some flighted exercise outside. Something that would be used for just a brief time and not necessarily everyday. With an assistant or a training stand or two the birds could fly a longer distance than in the house and get some sunshine.

My concern with parrots is they do live long enough for the zinc to accumulate from various sources so why add to that problem if you can avoid it. Or like you said, at least, 'be informed and make your own decision based on that information." .
Mary
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

My two cents on this would be that birds like finches aren't going to be all over the wire, with beaks and feet, like parrots will. Secretly, it kills me that I bend over backwards to give the parakeets room to fly and every exciting natural branch and vine, so many places to be, and they still climb the walls of the cage. It hurts my feelings! It also makes me feel bad because I have this idea that if the bird is on the wall then the cage isn't big enough. My cages are as big as they can be, for me, and plenty bigger than many. Still. Birds on the wall. :?
-MissK
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

Ahhhh, MissK don't feel bad. What kills me is I give my lovebirds a 12' x 15' room with several windows, and all they do to repay my generosity is poop on the walls!
Mary
MissK
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by MissK »

At least I only have one bird pooping on walls - my Canary.

Do you think they're trying to send a message with this???????
-MissK
Donovan
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Donovan »

They'll always climb the walls. In my big walk-in cage I keep a few perches around and always some large tree branch inside but ultimately my bird's favorite place seems to be a piece of board that makes up part of the wall. He can hardly even fit on it. His body is pressed up against the wire and he looks pretty awkward so don't worry about your budgies climbing the walls. It's just something they like to do.
AJPeter
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by AJPeter »

Bird on a wire,
if you want poop on the walls get a Mynah bird! If you do not want poop on the walls do not get a Mynah bird.
SkyeBerry
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by SkyeBerry »

MissK...if it is a message, I need to find an interpreter quickly because it is obviously something they think I really need to know!

Donovan - you can always trade that Mynah bird for a cage of finches. Then you can have poop on your walls, ceilings, counters...I swear they are having some sort of shooting contest.

I just read this post to a friend and her two cents - "so, it is a crap shoot where it is going to end up?" :mrgreen: :roll:
Mary
Melika
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Re: Choosing a New Cage

Post by Melika »

"Be informed and make your own decision based on that information."

I thought this was a good suggestion for galvanized wire, thoroughly and carefully brushing with a stiff wire brush to remove any 'chunks':
http://europepmc.org/abstract/MED/16243 ... qOPNi4m.20

A common article I referenced many times over the years:
http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww14eiii.htm

A blend of study and anecdote:
http://www.windycityparrot.com/Zinc_Par ... icity.html

This is probably the most well-balanced article on zinc I have read:
https://companionparrotonline.com/zinc.html

And this is a good research paper:
http://www.thebirdschool.com/parrot-hea ... m-fiction/


I guess the way I feel about it, is that the zinc toxicity scare is overplayed. While it certainly can be toxic, with the right bird that likes to chew on its cage and chew/eat non-food items, it isn't nearly the rampant parrot killer presented in many articles on the web. Some vets have even leapt on the train, asking everyone to test for zinc, even though serum levels of zinc don't give an accurate indication of anything at this time- in fact the samples are likely tainted. However, the scare might save some birds if it makes the parront more cautious and observant than they would be otherwise. :)

*It should be noted the zinc is able to be eliminated from the body but constant ingestion of it would obviously not allow the homeostatic process of the body to work properly in getting rid of the extra.
** Suspected case of zinc toxicity from plain aviary wire (the rest I've found were from paint and powder coatings on cage wires): http://www.bioone.org/doi/abs/10.1647/1 ... 2.0.CO%3B2
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I've been called 'birdbrained' before, but somehow I don't think this is what they meant. say:hah-nay
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