A "step up" in research for MissK

Moderator: Mods

Skyes_crew
Posts: 1946
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:49 pm
Location: Hawaii

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Skyes_crew »

I'm interested in the intellectual level of parents in play groups. I had a woman come up to me complaining about how cold she was. She then told me she wished she was a bird because they're body temp was higher so they must never be cold. She then proceeded to tell me that's why birds poop so much. I think I lost 30 IQ points talking to her. :?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

Image
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by InTheAir »

:lol: @ mel
There's a formula that situation; the lowest iq of the group ÷ by the number of members in the group = the iq of the group.
It sounds like your play group may be in the minuses.... maybe even triple digits. :wink:

Missk, for random interesting animal intelligence books; http://www.amazon.com/Next-Kin-My-Conve ... 0380728222
I read it about 10 years ago and I'm still raving about it. Also search Project Washoe on the net. Nothing beats a good book though!

Did anyone read the article by Mike doolan? I thought it was very interesting, I am a sucker for anyone that promotes flight in pet parrots...
Skyes_crew
Posts: 1946
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:49 pm
Location: Hawaii

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Skyes_crew »

I'm pretty sure my IQ is what's holding us afloat :lol:
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

Image
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

:roll:
-MissK
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by InTheAir »

[quote="InTheAir"] http://www.charlieandpeggy.com/mikedoolan.pdf
Did anyone read this one? There are some interesting ideas I'd love to discuss.
AlphaWolf
Posts: 289
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AlphaWolf »

My Dad is going to UK for a business meeting, so I have the chance to get 3 books. So I will definitely get: Don't Shoot the dog but what should the other two books be.
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf
ellieelectrons
Posts: 2708
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:17 am
Location: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by ellieelectrons »

Can you get a DVD? I think you'd enjoy Parrot Behaviour and Training #1 and possibly #2 from Barbara Heidenreich
http://www.goodbirdinc.com/parrot-store-dvds.html

Ellie.
AlphaWolf
Posts: 289
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AlphaWolf »

And what are the best books??? The top 3 I should get?
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

How about "How to become a millionaire overnight" and "How to live forever?"
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by InTheAir »

I was given Guide to Companion Parrot Behavior by Mattie Sue Athan for Christmas yesterday. I'm about half way through it. A lot of it is great, but the authors obsession with wing clipping is really grating on my nerves! The section on ringnecks says they "must" be clipped to prevent household accidents.
There isn't even a balanced explanation of both sides of the argument in the section about flight. I am rather offended by the comparisons used as an example too. Forum censoring will not allow me to quote one, the other is using the argument that birds that have evolved to be flightless in predator free countries don't miss flight. .. That strikes me as comparing apples to large hairy caterpillars. .. It's just not the same thing!
I don't know what it is like in usa, but i haven't had an avian vet recommend clipping my birds wings. The vets I've talked to have all been for well managed flighted birds.

It ruins what could be a great book in my eyes. Misses out on a whole parrot experience.

Rant over.
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

If you wrote a book Claire on companion bird behaviour there are bound to be people with different ideas but as long as they bought your book would you care?

Any way l shall not buy the book, l totally disagree with clipping a bird's wings if Mattie Sue Athan wants a flighless birds she should have written a book on companion penguin behaviour!

AJPeter
Jen&Bug
Posts: 98
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:02 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Jen&Bug »

Great thread MissK! I've also benefited from Mattie Sue Athan's wonderful books and sometimes wondered what else is out there beyond the basic "how to" manuals. I've dabbled in general animal behaviour books, but nothing bird-specific.

I work as a researcher (not in aviculture) so I couldn't resist doing some foraging. I found a good article called "A Bird in the House" (Patricia K. Anderson, in Society & Animals, December 2003), which included a literature review of prior research on companion parrots. Anderson found fewer than a dozen studies, most of which dealt with "the benefits of aviaries or aviculture in institutional settings", and identified companion parrot ownership as a worthwhile area for future research. There doesn't seem to have been a lot more since.

My hunch is that the human-parrot bond is likely to be the next "step up" in research about companion birds. There was a terrific article by Pamela Clarke about this in the latest Parrot Society of Australia magazine, challenging some common beliefs about our emotional attachment to our birds. A version of the article, "Ethical, Moral & Spiritual Considerations of Companion Parrot Care", is available on www.pamelaclarkonline.com/Articles.html I also enjoy reading other people's accounts of their life with birds, (e.g. "Wesley, the story of a remarkable owl").

For the less theoretically-minded, Pamela's website also has some awesome links for home-made enrichment toys (under "Enrichment"): http://www.pamelaclarkonline.com/Resources.html
Jen&Bug
Posts: 98
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:02 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Jen&Bug »

Oh, after my endorsement of MSA's books I should probably add that neither of my birds are clipped. Researching is just like foraging...some things you eat, other things you just munch on for a while and then let them go...
InTheAir
Posts: 2040
Joined: Sat Jan 12, 2013 4:24 pm

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by InTheAir »

AJPeter wrote:If you wrote a book Claire on companion bird behaviour there are bound to be people with different ideas but as long as they bought your book would you care?

Any way l shall not buy the book, l totally disagree with clipping a bird's wings if Mattie Sue Athan wants a flighless birds she should have written a book on companion penguin behaviour!

AJPeter
Apart from the wing clipping stuff, it really is a great book.
I'm sorry I put you off it, I think you'd really enjoy the authors writing style and benefit greatly from reading it. Just skip over the wing bits
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

You are right of course Claire it is best to read as many books and articles as possible to gain a balanced view.

AJPeter
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

Sorry I've been absent from my own thread!!

This Mattie Sue book, I think, is a very good book. She does advocate clipping, but I certainly hope she has changed her mind by now. It's possible. Honestly, when I read advice to clip, I just gloss over it and keep going.

AlphaWolf, if you are having only one book, I think Don't Shoot The Dog is the way to go. Next could be a Mattie Sue book, or something maybe someone else can suggest? Don't forget books on your other interests as well.
-MissK
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

What sort of book is "Do not shoot the dog?"
AJPeter
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

_Don't Shoot The Dog_, by Karen Pryor, is a book on Operant Conditioning. It explains some of the principles of how living organisms learn, and how to use those principles to teach others. I've used what I learned in this book to train my parrot, my dogs, my mother, and my coworkers. Perhaps they might have a copy in your local library. :) Amazon.co.uk has many second hand copies of the older edition offered at a low price. It seems those that ship from USA are actually cheaper to buy, costing .01 (I guess that's pounds?) plus 2.80 shipping charge for UK delivery.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listin ... ition=used

The current edition is offered brand new at 2.63 (and up) plus 2.80 shipping charge, coming from within the UK.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listin ... dition=new

I realize you may, due to your philosophy, not be initially interested in this particular book, but I urge you to look into it anyway. You may read it and discover some new concepts as well as find it simply uses new and fancy words to describe some things you have already known for years. A particularly entertaining second benefit would be that you may learn to recognize and name ways that Billie has used some of the very same concepts to train you!! :lol:
-MissK
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

Thank you MissK, l have ordered a new copy it will be delivered in a few days, l am not so arrogant that l cannot read and learn from Operant Conditioning. And l will wait and see. There is no doubt that Billie does train me, she gets what she wants.
AJPeter
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

AJ, I'm so glad you have ordered a copy of this book that I would like everyone to read. I've no doubt you will find it entertaining as well as informative. :D
-MissK
Skyes_crew
Posts: 1946
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:49 pm
Location: Hawaii

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Skyes_crew »

That book worked wonders on my marriage :wink:

Who says you can't teach an old dog new tricks :lol:
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

Image
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

Glad l am not married!
AJPeter
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

I have just read Charlie and Peggy, Claire. It took me over an hour to get through but it was jolly intersting when l started Parrot Speak this was the idea l wanted to get across, understand the bird is to understand the problem, get to know what your parrot is telling you.
Some things l did not agree with but one the whole this idea of flock and the pets bird's understanding of the rules is right up my street. Just this very evening Billie wanted to go to bed early and l wanted to watch "Pirates of the Carribean 4" Billie knows that is she bangs around in her cage even if covered she can force me to turn off the lights and TV and leave her in peace/ but l tried a to hood wink her by coming back in the room and switching on the TV but quickly she started to bang around so l gave up.
AJPeter
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

AJPeter wrote:Is the site for companion birds? Not sure if l have the right address "Knowing them inside out" and "Picking their brains!"
I think too much credence is given to people who write books on parrots, to click or not to click that is not the question but unexplained behaviour such as biting a foot might be solved by finding alternative things for your IRN to do once they start a behaviour pattern it is hard to break them out of it. There is nothing as good as observation, and if you bought a book on farming could you run a farm? No you need the good practical experience and of course learn from other people's experiences.
But well done MissK the next ime l need to know my parrot inside out l will come to you.
AJPeter
I have just read my post again and l think l must be an idiot for posting it, l speak without thinking. But the idea of harnessing a pig to plough is wasted on the pig because it uses its snout to turn over the sod come to think of it is wasted on the plough as well.
Somebody once said a little knowledge is dangerous but that is no excuse for not improving one's knowledge both in theory and practical, putting the therory into practice and the practice into theory.
AJPeter
Little Buttercup
Posts: 345
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:03 am

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Little Buttercup »

MissK wrote:AJ, I'm so glad you have ordered a copy of this book that I would like everyone to read. I've no doubt you will find it entertaining as well as informative. :D
Missk, I have downloaded a free PDF copy of Karen Pryor's Don't shoot the dog! Hoping it will be nice, interesting and useful :)

Ash
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

I bet you'll be Amazoning a hard copy soon. I took it everywhere with me when I first got it, and I was really big on flipping pages back and forth. Confession, I'm so old I really love paper books. :oops:
-MissK
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

You remember paper books MissK? Wow! you must be old. :o
AJPeter
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

Very old. Speaking of paper books, this one in particular...... Ah, how's it coming along with yours? :?:
-MissK
Little Buttercup
Posts: 345
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:03 am

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by Little Buttercup »

MissK wrote:I bet you'll be Amazoning a hard copy soon. I took it everywhere with me when I first got it, and I was really big on flipping pages back and forth. Confession, I'm so old I really love paper books. :oops:
Still have to go through it. Btw how old are you, Miss? :wink:

Ash
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

So old, so old. :wink: Old enough to know better and young enough not to care.
-MissK
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

I have got to page 18 of Don't shoot the dog and now l cannot find it l think Billie has got it in her nesting box becasue she has been laughing her self silly over what was written.
ellieelectrons
Posts: 2708
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:17 am
Location: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by ellieelectrons »

Hi MissK

I've been tracking down some research on foraging and I found this article:
Engebretson, M. (2006). "The welfare and suitability of parrots as companion animals: a review." ANIMAL WELFARE-POTTERS BAR THEN WHEATHAMPSTEAD- 15(3): 263.

It also has information on interactions between birds of same species and other species that I thought you should find interesting.

You should be able to download the whole article if you do a Google Scholar search. I managed to access it without having to use my university database access.

Ellie.
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

Ellie, wow. I didn't know about Google Scholar. I got that downloaded in 5 seconds! Now to find time to read it...... Thanks!
-MissK
AJPeter
Posts: 2534
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2013 3:17 pm
Location: Birmingham England
Contact:

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by AJPeter »

You could down load the article through Bing MissK, it is heavy going.
MissK
Posts: 3011
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2012 3:46 pm
Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: A "step up" in research for MissK

Post by MissK »

Thanks AJ. I got it through Google Scholar in five seconds already. If anybody else wants a try, this is how I did it:
1) Google the term "google scholar".
2) Click link for that.
3) Paste Ellie's entire reference to the work into the browser in the middle of the Google Scholar page.
4) Click enter.
-MissK
Post Reply