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lawnmowerman5502
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:33 pm

New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:42 pm

Just joined this great information wonder land on these birds. Thought I would say hi and
hello to everyone. Just got a 2 year old yellow male and I have a lot to learn. :D :?:

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Skyes_crew
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Location: Hawaii

Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Thu Jul 25, 2013 8:31 pm

Welcome to the forum! :) what is your birds name?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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Little Buttercup
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Re: New member

Post by Little Buttercup » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:19 pm

Hi and welcome, Is your bird tame? :)

Ash

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:51 pm

Thanks for the welcome! My birds name is Tolie. He is kinda of tame but very possessive of any kind of toy with a bell
on it. I have been bitten two times now that made me bleed errr. He's been pinning his eyes and holding his wings up as to
want to fight. Ok as of tonight he did not try to attack me and he approached me from the bottom of his cage and was
being very nice. :D The previous owner said he was not mean, but I think I got off on the wrong foot with him messing
with his toy. How long will they stay mad over something like that?

MissK
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Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: New member

Post by MissK » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:43 pm

I don't think he's holding any grudge because you touched his stuff! We need more details!


And welcome!

-MissK
-MissK

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Fri Jul 26, 2013 8:52 pm

I agree!! What were you doing with the toy?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Sat Jul 27, 2013 8:39 pm

He takes the bell and plays with the piece in side to make it ring then wolf whistles real loud.
Well I thought he was playing with it, so I take my finger and so the same thing, and boom he's all over me.
I talked to the previous owner today and he has never bit them. He acts as if to be protecting the bell on the toy
so I got a new some what similar toy with a slightly bigger bell and as soon as he heard the bell, he went nuts trying to find it and get to it. I put the new toy in the cage and he goes back and forth to them making them ring and then whistling again. I can take them out and he will search until he finds them. I have no idea lol.

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Sat Jul 27, 2013 10:19 pm

Quick question...are we sure it's a male?

That aside, it may be possible the old owners teased him mercilessly with a bell. Not everyone tells the truth :roll: and he may be aggressive towards bells now. It's an easy fix though really. Take bells away :)
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:47 am

I am not 100% he's a boy. he's not mean to the bells at all, it's like don't mess with them there mine. He's like a little kid that
doesn't want to share his toys. When I took them out he was sad and quiet, didn't want to do anything but screech real loud
every now and then.

MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Sun Jul 28, 2013 10:07 am

Hmmmm. (Thinking noises....)

It *is* true that Rocky, in the past, had some issues where he did not want me touching his things. For instance, I would pick up the toy and he would seek to get it away from me by looking aggressive and making a clearly hostile noise, possibly striking towards me with the beak.

Can I recall how this resolved, as it happened so long ago and was so brief, I had forgotten all about it till now........?

All I really remember is that, being me, I refused to accommodate his wishes. Typically, I will not allow my animal to claim "stuff" exclusively, within reason. I will allow an animal to be unmolested in their "safe place", for instance. On the other hand, for example, I do employ the practice of taking the animal's food, adding something nice, and promptly returning the "new and improved" food, as a means to ensure maximum handleability. All toys and cages are "jointly owned", if that makes sense. NOTE: Do not ever try to just walk up to an animal and take their food without having made some reasonable preparation. Animals naturally defend their food in many cases. I say this so nobody will just march up to a creature, steal its food, be bitten, and blame me. My animals are trained to accept this.

This might be controversial behaviour on my part, probably makes me look like a jerk, but it's how I roll, and I have not noted any bad result. And it seems to work. For Rocky, it means I can touch anything "of his". It doesn't mean I can touch himself against his wish; that's not what I do. I respect him and his needs, just not his wish to have Mr. Froggy entirely to himself every minute, even when I need to clean the poop off it.

For anyone interested in my method, I just gently insist on doing whatever it was I needed to do. Say Mr. Froggy is covered in poop and I pick it up. If Rocky were to come to repossess the toy, I would just gently divert any attack and get on with my business of taking it. Once cleaned, I would hand it right back to him, not just drop it in the cage and go. But, as mentioned, this doesn't even happen, because when Rocky went through that "don't touch my stuff" phase, I just refused to accommodate him. However it was processed in his mind, he quickly learned not to bother with any display, and it's a non-issue today.

-MissK
-MissK

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Sun Jul 28, 2013 12:53 pm

No I agree 100% MissK. I don't let any one of my birds get attached to an object. I do the same things as you. I deflect and ignore. I can't have my flock arguing over a toy. It could get bloody. In extreme cases I take the object away and reintroduce it later on.

Lawn man (sorry had to shorten that :) )

Maybe try removing just the center part of the bell for now and reintroduce it after he calms down over the bell a little. It could just be that he's in a new home, new surroundings, and the bell is the only thing familiar so that's his way of lashing out against the fear of the unknown. Just give him time :)
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:57 pm

Just thinking out loud, what would happen if instead there were ten bells?

-MissK
-MissK

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:09 am

He could start a band :lol:
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Mon Jul 29, 2013 8:20 am

Hahaha! Note to Claire, Buy Some More Bells............

-MissK
-MissK

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:38 pm

I think the bells give him some sense of security. He's doing better and better all the time and now he is taking treats
from my fingers but still very cautious about it. I will get more toys for him to play with and see how he does. I only give him treats when he comes down off a perch to greet me in a nice way. If he runs at me I go on and come back later and try again. My lab Sara and I were playing tug and the more intense our play got the more Tolie watched and payed attention. I think its just a matter of time and building his trust that I am not going to hurt him.

MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Mon Jul 29, 2013 7:46 pm

By all means, let him watch you gently stroking and hand feeding the dog. I believe it will help. My dogs taught my bird to eat strawberries, you know!

:D
-MissK
-MissK

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Sun Aug 04, 2013 6:54 pm

Well I don't know what to think about my bird. I took the toys with bells out and hung them above the top of the cage where he can still see them. If I ring one of them or reach for it he go's nut's screeching and hanging upside down off the roof of his cage. If I keep messing with the bell's on the toys he starts moving his head and neck left to right really fast. I guess I am making him mad at this point because he tries to bite me at this point. I let him out today and he got on top of the cage where the toys are and when I try to get him to step up he does run, but will eventually get on my hand and goes right up my arm to sit on my shoulder. When there he 's not mean or trying to bite any more. Later today in his cage I tried to get him to step up and he really laid into me it did hurt but he didn't bring blood but he was latched on for a good 10-15 sec each time. Now tonight I went back to him and and messed with the toys he immediately starts screeching and shaking his head as to tell me no or to quit. On top of all this he will take treats from my fingers without any aggression. Maybe this thread or part of it needs to be moved to IRNs Behavior & Taming? Thanks

MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:08 pm

I think the bell should go on vacation for a few weeks.

-MissK
-MissK

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InTheAir
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Re: New member

Post by InTheAir » Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:20 pm

MissK wrote:Hahaha! Note to Claire, Buy Some More Bells............

-MissK
Hmmmm where can I get tuned bells from. ....
Nilas whole interest in bells extends to trying to remove the clapper. Be careful of cat toy bells, some have ball bearings that can be removed by questing beaks, I made that mistake a few weeks ago... luckily I noticed Nila munching one and swapped him for a treat.

I agree that the removing the Bell sounds like a good plan.


-Claire

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Mon Aug 05, 2013 4:27 am

Ok I removed the toys with the bells this morning and wow did he throw a fit. They were actually above his cage on a platform, now he is calling out loudly trying to fine them I guess.

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InTheAir
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Re: New member

Post by InTheAir » Mon Aug 05, 2013 4:42 am

Hopefully he will forget about them soon, or atleast lose interest in their memory.
Is there any chance he can see his reflection in the bells?

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:31 pm

Maybe try playing some music for him to calm him down while he's trying to forget the bells. :)
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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solobaby
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Re: New member

Post by solobaby » Mon Aug 05, 2013 12:36 pm

i would not give him the bells back
not to be nasty but because i think it could cause aggression later on
and in a way his attachment seems unhealthy

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Mon Aug 05, 2013 8:37 pm

He calmed down quickly, he is in the living room so he can her the tv and see all thats going on.
When I got home from work I go to talk to him and he charges at me. I talk to him for awhile and
then leave him alone, but I sit close to his cage. After about 20 min I offer a peanut and again he came after
me. So I did not let him have the treat. One hour later he was fine and took it nicely. He might be seeing himself in
the bells, is that good or bad? I know this is not the best way to do this but if I try to get him to step up
on my hand he will attack, but if I put on a glove he does go to the back of his cage but then gets right on.
He is very smart and will not attack when the glove is on, but only when its off. I have so much to learn about him
and I hope he will not be so mean soon.

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:48 pm

I think I have to go back to my original question about him being a boy. To me this sounds like female behavior. Territorial about the bells, and territorial about the cage. Any chance I could talk you into a DNA test? It would help to know male or female because training is slightly different. Behaviors are very different.
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:45 am

We did have someone on the forum a while back who had a problem with the bird seeing his reflection in food cups, and that was causing trouble. I would say don't rule out a reflection in bells theory. One of my Budgies actually chirps to himself in the water tube holder, but not so much since I got him a real mirror.

-MissK
-MissK

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:03 am

I will post a picture soon, the bird does not have the black ring under the beak just a reddish ring around the neck.

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:44 am

He's a male then :D Lutino's a get a red ring. Maybe MissK's theory about seeing himself is something to investigate. Do you have a small mirror you could place near his cage?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:57 am

That was lawn man's theory, actually. I just pulled up some supporting examples.

When I gave the Budgie the mirror I also gave one to Rocky. He visits it now and then, but overall it seems less attractive to him than, say, his shower curtain rings. One could make a case that I love MY mirror more than either of the birds loves theirs.......

:D

-MissK
-MissK

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:39 am

I did put a big mirror behind the cage and he acted a little funny but got use to it. It wasn't there very long though. This morning he came at me while I was changing out his water. I ll try to post a video on you-tube and link it back to here so you can see what hes doing, but it will be later tonight.

MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:40 am

Stuff like this makes me really wish I could visit and see the bird in action.

-MissK
-MissK

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:55 am

Me too...who were his previous owners? Male, female, children? Who predominantly handled him? How soon after the move to your house did you start trying to handle him?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:05 pm

They were an older couple, but I don't think they worked with him other than feeding him. I know them very well and they were not mean to him. My wife and I started working with him as soon as we got him. He didn't show aggression until I messed with the toy in the cage 2 days later.

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:30 pm

Well tried to post a pic and got a message "Sorry board attachment quota has been reached".

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:18 pm

Try making a few more posts. What photo hosting sight are you using?

Can you try to make a video of what the bird is doing and upload it to YouTube? Then post the link for us?
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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bwalsh0206
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Re: New member

Post by bwalsh0206 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:26 am

Hello everyone,

I am new to this forum and website but my fiancee is a regular poster and has spoken very highly of everyone here and the advice she's received regarding our IRN Remy. I'm pleased to join this forum and look forward to many interesting conversations with all of you about our experiences and yours alike!

Best,
Brian

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:05 am

Hey Brian!!! Are you Josies's fiancé? Welcome to our family :D
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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bwalsh0206
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Re: New member

Post by bwalsh0206 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:09 am

I am Josie's fiancee, yes! Thank you for making me feel welcome, I'm really looking forward to learning more about Remy and his people :lol:

Brian

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:15 am

Lawn man...my male has a weird attachment of sorts to his bamboo ladder. He sleeps on it sometimes, he preens it (it has feathers) and sometimes I see him attacking it. If I need to clean it and he looks to be about to lunge, I curl my fingers in tight and offer the back of my hand in a tight fist. Not much to bite there. He hasn't been doing it lately since I started doing that. IRN's have a common fear of fingers. He's otherwise a very sweet bird. I think maybe you disturbed his "relationship" with his bell and he's having a hard time forgiving that. But you can't let him run you. I want you to walk up to his cage confidently, open the door, and offer the back of your hand in a tight fist. Slightly push into him. It's a form of negative reinforcement, and ill probably get slammed for it, but I think your situation warrants it. I do not recommend this to someone who has a bird that has not been previously hand tamed. He may balk and try to find an area to bite on the back of your hand. Remember to keep that fist tight. You have to gain back the upper hand so to speak. Do not pull away when he lunges or that reinforces his behavior. Let me know how that goes. If you could video tape it that would be great. If you don't have a YouTube account, you could email it to me and I could upload it here for you. :)
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:17 am

Josie is such a great bird mommy :D you'll have fun here. Don't forget to check out Nilas human training page :D
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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bwalsh0206
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Re: New member

Post by bwalsh0206 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:29 am

Josie is a wonderful bird Mommy, you're right! She's definitely inspiring to watch and I've learned a lot from her. She and I were talking about the human training stuff this morning and it sounds pretty funny and informative :D

lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:47 pm

Skye, I have been doing exactly that and he moves to the back of the cage, and I continue
to talk to him and he will step up 6 out of 10 times with no aggression. Since I have removed the toy he has become much more focused on what I am doing. We have a pair of budgies next to him and he is now wanting to get out and go explore
around on there cage. He has flew a few times and is not very good at it but when he lands he is very easy to get on your hand and goes right to my shoulder and seems to be happy there. I think now that the possessiveness is going away I need to focus on gaining his trust. I feel that I am going in the right direction with him now for the most part.

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Skyes_crew
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Re: New member

Post by Skyes_crew » Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:51 pm

That is great news!!! I hope everything continues to move in the positive direction for you :D
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

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lawnmowerman5502
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Re: New member

Post by lawnmowerman5502 » Sun Aug 11, 2013 7:16 pm

I am no longer getting the possessiveness over objects in his cage and the pinning of the eyes. He does run to the back of the cage when I approach but it gets better all the time. Last few days he has been singing and has made sounds I have never heard a bird make. Easily taking food and treats now from the hand now, Id say good progress for 3-4 weeks of getting him.

Little Buttercup
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Re: New member

Post by Little Buttercup » Thu Aug 15, 2013 11:05 pm

bwalsh0206 wrote:I am Josie's fiancee, yes! Thank you for making me feel welcome, I'm really looking forward to learning more about Remy and his people :lol:

Brian
Welcome Brian, heard alot about your Remy

Ash

MissK
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Re: New member

Post by MissK » Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:51 am

Welcome Brian!

Lawnman, is he also dancing and waving the wings? That's one of my favourite things!

-MissK
-MissK

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