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Colour of feet and nails

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Lushen1600
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:18 am
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

Colour of feet and nails

Post by Lushen1600 » Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:45 am

Hi all, sorry I have been away for a while, been busy and not been able to post much, but have been on a few times to read a little

I have a question for you guys, at what age is one certain of what the colour of a young birds feet will be, can you tell from day 1 in the nestbox if a baby will have dark feet and dark nails, or does the colour of the babies feet and nails darken as the bird matures? If so as what age will the true colour of the feet and nails be revealed

Here are a few pics of a greygreen bird that I have bred this season, and for some odd reason this greygreen is darker in feather colour than other greygreens that I have bred, but also has very light feet with very light nails(almost pink) I have another baby as reference but can only confirm the true genetic makeup of the reference bird when I have it sexed, as if it is a male then it will be a grey turquoise pallidino, but if a female then will be a grey turquoise ino, either way the reference bird has pink feet and light nails. Please excuse the quality of the pics as they are taken out with my mobile phone.
Image

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Please note that these birds are now weaned and eating on their own for a few weeks now, all comments welcome, what I would like to know is why the feet of the greygreen bird are so light, could this indicate a split that the bird may be carrying and if so, what split would that be, parents of the greygreen bird are a green male to a grey lacewing female

Thanks
Lushen
2014 Pairs
Green x Green
DGreen x DBlue
DE Blue/ino x DBlue
Grey/ino x Albino
Pallidino x Lutino
DE Blue Turq x Grey
DE Grey Turq x Blue
Greygreen/cinn x DE Blue Cinn
DE DBlue Turq x Blue Turq CHWT
Blue x DBlue Turq
Blue x Blue Pallid
Lutino/blue x Blue

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Recio » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:12 am

Hi Luschen,

Which is the genetic make up of the parents?

Recio

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Lushen1600
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:18 am
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Lushen1600 » Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:26 pm

Hi Recio, parents of the greygreen bird with light feet with light nails is a

Green Male(which according to the breeder was bred from a DF Turquoise male to a Blue Turquiose female)

paired to a Grey Lacewing Female(bred from either a Blue lacewing male to a Grey lacewing female or a Grey lacewing male to a Grey lacewing female, breeder not sure)

So as you can see the breeders records are not reliable so I can't go with what he tells me as I still can't get how he bred the Green male from DF Turquoise to the Blue Turquoise?

Thanks
Lushen
2014 Pairs
Green x Green
DGreen x DBlue
DE Blue/ino x DBlue
Grey/ino x Albino
Pallidino x Lutino
DE Blue Turq x Grey
DE Grey Turq x Blue
Greygreen/cinn x DE Blue Cinn
DE DBlue Turq x Blue Turq CHWT
Blue x DBlue Turq
Blue x Blue Pallid
Lutino/blue x Blue

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sheyd
Posts: 1293
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:22 pm

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by sheyd » Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:59 pm

Hi Lushen- I asked a similar question not too long ago. I believe we as a group will start to see more and more light footed irn's because we as a group take notice of these things. I also believe it is more common than once thought, because they seem to pop up fairly regularly on here.
.............
It has been suggested that CHF & Reccessive Pied spits can/do cause 'visual' feet in some birds- however some may just have 'light' feet without any known explanation :?:

Johan S
Posts: 1215
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:24 am
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Johan S » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:17 pm

Lushen1600 wrote:I have another baby as reference but can only confirm the true genetic makeup of the reference bird when I have it sexed, as if it is a male then it will be a grey turquoise pallidino, but if a female then will be a grey turquoise ino, either way the reference bird has pink feet and light nails. Please excuse the quality of the pics as they are taken out with my mobile phone.
Image
Hi Lushen, welcome back to the forum. From the picture, it looks like a grey turq pallid hen to me. Are you sure the cock bird is split ino and not split pallid? Your sexing results will confirm whether it is a hen, though.

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Lushen1600
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:18 am
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Lushen1600 » Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:16 am

Hi Sheyd, thanks for the reply, I'm of the opinion that the light coloured feet point towards a mutation that the bird maybe split to, but not sure which.

Hi Johan, the parents of the reference bird is as follows

Cock bird is a Grey which I purchased from Carmen, bred from a Grey(df)blue cock to an Albino hen

Hen is a Blue Turquoise Pallid bred from a Blue Turquoise Pallid cock to a Blue Turquoise Pallid hen

Thanks
Lushen
2014 Pairs
Green x Green
DGreen x DBlue
DE Blue/ino x DBlue
Grey/ino x Albino
Pallidino x Lutino
DE Blue Turq x Grey
DE Grey Turq x Blue
Greygreen/cinn x DE Blue Cinn
DE DBlue Turq x Blue Turq CHWT
Blue x DBlue Turq
Blue x Blue Pallid
Lutino/blue x Blue

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Skyes_crew
Posts: 1944
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2013 12:49 pm
Location: Hawaii

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Skyes_crew » Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:53 am

If the grey is /Ino I would say its a turq grey PallidIno. Very pretty bird :D

I also have a bird with unexplained pink feet and light nails. He's a violet...but he was born with dark nails and they lightened. Johan has seen pics of this bird. We believe him to be /CHF.
I am owned by my birds...and I wouldn't have it any other way :D

Image

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sheyd
Posts: 1293
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2008 11:22 pm

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by sheyd » Sun Dec 29, 2013 2:59 am

I agree- looks like a TurqGrey PallidIno.

Lushen-I've had a look at one of my 'this year's young' who had light fleshy feet- and to my surprise they're starting to look more grey as one would expect (she's a Wildtype)
Hatched on the 21st of Aug so took awhile- interestingly, it's coincided with her first molt.

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Recio » Sun Dec 29, 2013 5:08 am

Lushen1600 wrote:So as you can see the breeders records are not reliable so I can't go with what he tells me as I still can't get how he bred the Green male from DF Turquoise to the Blue Turquoise?
Lushen
Hi Luschen,

A green bird from two blue series birds? If true, you have a precious bird split for two different blue genes (either in total or in partial mutations). You should do some inbreeding to check it, or even better: try to buy his parents to the breeder :wink: .

Regards

Recio

PS: post reedited since I was mixing the data of the Grey Green bird and the data of the reference bird. :oops:

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Lushen1600
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:18 am
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa

Re: Colour of feet and nails

Post by Lushen1600 » Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:33 pm

Hi guys thanks for the reply, I also believe that the reference bird could be a grey turquoise pallidino as when I pulled it for handrearing and compared it to a lutino baby about the same age that I was handrearing at the time, I found that it had a more plum(darker red) coloured eyes as compared to the red eyes of the lutino, and the feathers showed no signs of blue, so I believe it is a grey bird. It also has slight yellow on the head and flights which make me to believe that turq is definitely involved. Will know for sure what I'm dealing with after I have the bird surgically sexed when Dr Kingsley comes to PMB, and the bird will look better after the 3 month moult as now the feathers are dirty due to handrearing. Page 142 and 143 of Bastiaans second book shows what a mature grey turq pallidino looks like, although my bird is far from looking like the bird in Bastiaans book, I'm sure that it will change drastically after the 27 month moult when it gets a neck ring if it is a male.

Hi Recio, when I gave the parents of the greygreen baby I should have mentioned that the mum is a grey lacewing in the blue series(sorry, my fault) so the mother is actually a grey(sf)blue pallid.

Thanks
Lushen
2014 Pairs
Green x Green
DGreen x DBlue
DE Blue/ino x DBlue
Grey/ino x Albino
Pallidino x Lutino
DE Blue Turq x Grey
DE Grey Turq x Blue
Greygreen/cinn x DE Blue Cinn
DE DBlue Turq x Blue Turq CHWT
Blue x DBlue Turq
Blue x Blue Pallid
Lutino/blue x Blue

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