All registrations must be approved by an admin. Having problems with registration? E-mail us at indianringnecks@gmail.com

What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!! HELP

Moderator: Mods

Post Reply
bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!! HELP

Post by bdt9413 » Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:09 pm

Hello I have a male Latino an he has peach color cheek patches and peach all on the top and back of his head, what mutation is this?

try this 3 link to view the pics

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/1999/photowlln.jpg
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/1269 ... e050td.jpg
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/2619 ... e056hb.jpg
Last edited by bdt9413 on Sun Jan 27, 2013 5:57 pm, edited 5 times in total.

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: What Latino mutation I have? Need help

Post by Recio » Sun Jan 27, 2013 1:32 pm

Hi,

If you send me the pic I will post it for you.

Recio

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Latino mutation I have? Need help

Post by bdt9413 » Sun Jan 27, 2013 2:46 pm

i dont know how to do that :(

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Latino mutation I have? Need help

Post by bdt9413 » Sun Jan 27, 2013 3:09 pm

Recio wrote:Hi,

If you send me the pic I will post it for you.

Recio
You can try the links :) and thanks alot thought

User avatar
prodigy
Posts: 342
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:52 am
Location: South Africa

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by prodigy » Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:26 pm

HI

Any chance of getting pictures of under the wings and tail as well as close ups of the eye and nails?

Thanks,

Peter

minivip2001
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 9:26 am
Location: Italia
Contact:

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by minivip2001 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:01 am

hello the problem is the power .......... likely avitaminosis :(

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by Recio » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:35 pm

Hi bdt 9413,

Could you tell us how old is the bird and how long ago he has his reddish feathers? Did he breed any similar offspring? Who were the parents? Is it a SL-ino or a NSL-ino? Is it split for any known mutation which could act on psittacins, ex Opaline? ... and any other inpout you can get from the breeder.

Recio

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:02 am

Recio wrote:Hi bdt 9413,

Could you tell us how old is the bird and how long ago he has his reddish feathers? Did he breed any similar offspring? Who were the parents? Is it a SL-ino or a NSL-ino? Is it split for any known mutation which could act on psittacins, ex Opaline? ... and any other inpout you can get from the breeder.

Recio
The bird is 3 1/2 years old, he had the reddish color coming in when then pink ring around his neck came, ans that was when he was like 1year 1/2 of age. and the rest of the question i dont know cause i just bought him as a baby, and dont have no clue who the parents are, and i have no contact of the breeder her moved, and changed his number like 5months ago :(

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:06 am

No, hes a "wild" breeder bird, so when ever i get close to the cage he flys away, and always moving, and if i zoom in the picture wont be clear, but both of his feet are pink, toe nails are also all pink, his eye is black, and is iris is white/peach. hope this helps. :D

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by Recio » Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:40 am

bdt9413 wrote:No, hes a "wild" breeder bird, so when ever i get close to the cage he flys away, and always moving, and if i zoom in the picture wont be clear, but both of his feet are pink, toe nails are also all pink, his eye is black, and is iris is white/peach. hope this helps. :D
... if his eye is black the bird is not a lutino but, probably, a BEC (Black Eye Clear bird).
Where are you located? In Australia?

Recio

User avatar
angeldc77
Posts: 167
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:53 pm

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by angeldc77 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:04 pm

Correct me if I'm wrong, a clear bird is an extremely heavy pied or clear pied right? Perhaps that would explain the red spreading around his head. Excuse the novice for trying to come up with a theory :mrgreen:

I did have some lutino pied cockatiels that had a similar occurrence with the red patch on his cheek spreading around his head.

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by Recio » Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:14 pm

Hi,

We can obtain clear birds (without melanin in feathers) by combining some mutations. The BEC refers to a black eye clear bird produced by a DF dom pied. In green series it looks like lutino (but with dark eyes) and in blue series is similar to an albino, although showing a bluish iridescence.

DF dom pieds are supposed to express a higher concentration of psittacins than normal lutinos. They also show a higher fluorescence under uv. The production of red psittacins seems to be somehow dependent on a threshold concentration of yellow psittacins, and , thus, a DF dom pied through an increased production of psittacins could, in theory, produce increased red psittacins. In other species as the African Grey it seems that the production of red psittacins is inhibited by the presence of melanocytes and DF dom pied DF rec pied are completelly red. In DF dom pied IRN there are not melanocytes at the feather follicle allowing an increased production of yellow psittacins and, perhaps (like in the African Grey), a lack of inhibition in the production of red psittacins.

Another possibility is that this bird is a combo of DF dom pied and Opaline, which would increase the production of red psittacins. If the owner is in Australia this could be a good explanation because in this country the Dom pied mutation has been bred to Opalines in the early times, producing birds with a similar phenotype to Dom pied, so that the Opaline mutation could be in the mix and nobody noticed it (perhaps this is similar for saddlebacks?).

Anyway there are not many breeders with this mutation and looking at the ring number of the bird you should be able to find the original breeder and to know more about its genetics. If Opaline is not in the mix and it is just a DF dom pied you should try to breed it to Opalines trying ot get a more intense and extensive redness.

Regards

Recio

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:20 pm

Recio wrote:
bdt9413 wrote:No, hes a "wild" breeder bird, so when ever i get close to the cage he flys away, and always moving, and if i zoom in the picture wont be clear, but both of his feet are pink, toe nails are also all pink, his eye is black, and is iris is white/peach. hope this helps. :D
... if his eye is black the bird is not a lutino but, probably, a BEC (Black Eye Clear bird).
Where are you located? In Australia?

Recio
No, United States

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Tue Jan 29, 2013 5:22 pm

angeldc77 wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, a clear bird is an extremely heavy pied or clear pied right? Perhaps that would explain the red spreading around his head. Excuse the novice for trying to come up with a theory :mrgreen:

I did have some lutino pied cockatiels that had a similar occurrence with the red patch on his cheek spreading around his head.
Really! ooh ok cool thanks, but did you IRN's with patches on its head? :)

User avatar
prodigy
Posts: 342
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:52 am
Location: South Africa

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by prodigy » Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:42 pm

This is exactly why I am ask for you to catch the bird and look under the wings, the next level of progression of red is usualy under the wings and then in the tail.

Attached some of my examples.

Pallid
Image

Yellow Bird
Image

Yellow Bird
Image

Pallid
Image

Pallid
Image

My advice for this season would be to get that blue bird out of the cage and try and stay in the green series birds, so another Lutino(highly florescent if possible) or a Green Pallid or an Opaline female if you have some cash to throw at trying to breed possibly the most important color in IRN's (the holy grail of the ultimate IRN to bread is a completely RED or Black bird)

This is what I am referring to when i say highly florescent if possible
Image

Image

regards,

Peter

Recio
Posts: 966
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:09 am
Location: France

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by Recio » Wed Jan 30, 2013 2:10 am

molossus wrote:BTW many normal lutinos have a pink flush fading from the ring towards the cheeks.
Hi Lee

... and those are the lutinos that should be used to combine with dom pied and/or opaline looking for the highest redness.

Regards

Recio

User avatar
prodigy
Posts: 342
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:52 am
Location: South Africa

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by prodigy » Wed Jan 30, 2013 6:03 am

hey Lee, in that case send me all the IRN pets you have my bud ;-)

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:08 am

Recio wrote:
bdt9413 wrote:No, hes a "wild" breeder bird, so when ever i get close to the cage he flys away, and always moving, and if i zoom in the picture wont be clear, but both of his feet are pink, toe nails are also all pink, his eye is black, and is iris is white/peach. hope this helps. :D
... if his eye is black the bird is not a lutino but, probably, a BEC (Black Eye Clear bird).
Where are you located? In Australia?

Recio
Whats a "black eye, clear bired"? so whats does that mean, what is he split or mixed to?
~thanks

bdt9413
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

Re: What Lutino mutation do I have? breeder said its rare!!

Post by bdt9413 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:16 am

Recio wrote:Hi,

We can obtain clear birds (without melanin in feathers) by combining some mutations. The BEC refers to a black eye clear bird produced by a DF dom pied. In green series it looks like lutino (but with dark eyes) and in blue series is similar to an albino, although showing a bluish iridescence.

DF dom pieds are supposed to express a higher concentration of psittacins than normal lutinos. They also show a higher fluorescence under uv. The production of red psittacins seems to be somehow dependent on a threshold concentration of yellow psittacins, and , thus, a DF dom pied through an increased production of psittacins could, in theory, produce increased red psittacins. In other species as the African Grey it seems that the production of red psittacins is inhibited by the presence of melanocytes and DF dom pied DF rec pied are completelly red. In DF dom pied IRN there are not melanocytes at the feather follicle allowing an increased production of yellow psittacins and, perhaps (like in the African Grey), a lack of inhibition in the production of red psittacins.

Another possibility is that this bird is a combo of DF dom pied and Opaline, which would increase the production of red psittacins. If the owner is in Australia this could be a good explanation because in this country the Dom pied mutation has been bred to Opalines in the early times, producing birds with a similar phenotype to Dom pied, so that the Opaline mutation could be in the mix and nobody noticed it (perhaps this is similar for saddlebacks?).

Anyway there are not many breeders with this mutation and looking at the ring number of the bird you should be able to find the original breeder and to know more about its genetics. If Opaline is not in the mix and it is just a DF dom pied you should try to breed it to Opalines trying ot get a more intense and extensive redness.

Regards

Recio
ok thanks sooooooooooooooooo!! much for the info? but what did you mean by the ring number i should find the breeder, i dont think he has a ring number :D

Post Reply