Requiring advice about flying!

Janet · Post by **Janet** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:01 pm

Hi everyone. I hope someone can give me some advice. When I got my 2 ringnecks they were 3 months old and had their wings clipped. They have now grown their primary wing feathers back and are starting to fly (without much grace and finess yet!). They turned one year old mid October. My avian vet wants me to allow them to fly but will clip their wings if I want. I don't know what to do. They live inside with me but I have a wood heater that can get hot and lots of big windows. I am scared they are going to bang into the windows and hurt themselves or burn themselves on the heater. Am I worrying about nothing? Is it better to let them fly or clip their wings? I like to see them fly but couldn't bear it if something happened to them.
Regards, Janet (Floss and Bird's mum)

laine · Post by **laine** » Thu Nov 13, 2008 9:27 pm

Hi Janet, I have always had Smokey's wings clipped. He follows me everywhere. He is now 3 years old and for the first time, I have not had his wings clipped. He loves to be in the same room as me, so as soon as I leave, he flies after me. He doesn't fly away from me, generally, unless he gets a sudden scare. My personal worry is him flying out an opened door :cry:

, I would be very distraught if anything happened to him. I kept his wings clipped all this time, so I could tame him. I think whether you clip them or not, they need constant supervision to help reduce those accidents around the home. If I have Smokey's wings clipped, I know he will follow me on foot and therefore runs a high risk of being trodden on or accidentally kicked etc, so he is probably safer being able to fly to me than walk. Obviously you are going to have to watch them around the fire and take the necessary precautions. I too have alot of big windows but keep blinds or curtains there so there are no sudden crashes.

alana8819 · Post by **alana8819** » Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:13 am

i personally keep them clipped after letting them learn to fly first so that they can land. I didn't clip my first babies wings and he got out flew to the top of a massive tree and when he tried to come down he was swooped and chased away by minor birds

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:02 am

Now my little one has started flying confidently around the house, i have been wondering about clipping as well, just wondering if i should or not,

my main concern is that will it make them not as tame or the bird will resent it and not come near me, has anybody found that to be the case after they clipped the wings for the first time. how long roughly does it take once clipped for the wing to grow back enabling full flight again

you dont shorten your kids leg when they start walking :lol:

Fah · Post by **Fah** » Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:30 pm

Deano wrote:you dont shorten your kids leg when they start walking

True, but your kids cant make several hundred metres of movement in a few moments after opening the door either hehe. (not until they are older anyway heh)

I have been clipping and controlling pet bird flight for years now and after trying the no clip method, the clip method, my semi clip method I have come to the conclusion giving your pet bird full flight ability indoors is utterly useless and if anything, less beneficial than a semi clip.. not to mention the risks far outweigh the benefits.

note: semi clip method (looks like a full wing when collapsed but expanded you can see each feather has the larger side of the feather clipped off from the 'stem' so you have a full "half" feather if that makes sense) will post some pics later.. not for the new clipping parents unless you have help.

Full clipping in its first year (after it has already learnt how to fly) is the easier way to maintain training, and focus of your bird. This sets up dependancy upon you to start as well.

Birds will not "resent" you for clipping their wings unless you torment them doing it. The reason some people often struggle with clipped birds is because they are not meeting their NEEDS! Often neglecting what the bird is trying to express, or misunderstand what it wants.

A clipped bird relies 100% on you to get around quickly and safely unless it has structures to climb over and from etc but generally... if it wants to go over there, that fuss you see might be it just saying "over there now please" or "near you please" or "back to my cage please" etc.

A fully clipped bird serves little to no purpose unless you fre fly your bird outside or you have an extremely large house with serious flight space available.

A semi clipped bird is what I believe everyone should have on their pets unless they are comfortable with understanding their clipped birds needs.. there are cosmetic ways of doing this so it appears like the wing is untouched unless its in flight incase that is one of your reasons for not wanting a clip.

You see, indoor birds dont do anywhere near the exercise a bird technically should get... this health problem is often overcome by thoroughly healthy diets, and other activities, however I have always had happier birds that can fly around.

What a semi clip does is keeps the birds flight ability... however seriously impacts on the energy it takes to fly, making the bird work harder to get somewhere. Now... in your home environment, small flight area... this has many advantages... flying suddenly helps maintain the birds natural ability as well as giving it a mini workout... it also is not going to be able to make it several hundred metres from your house if it gets spooked and takes flight past your shoulder into the world... making recapture a sinch!

The people who are against clipping "its cruel" or "its not natural" are fundamentally flawed. You have taken a bird capable of extreme flight and shoved it into a shoebox in comparison (your home). The bird does not need to fly IF you are a good understanding owner who can read your birds signals and you give it a great healthy diet.... this is key!

Birds do not "feel" any form of damage done to feathers in the mature state, there are no if's or but's about this. If you have done a nasty job at clipping then you face the mental stress the bird will face of trying to keep the feathers maintained. Mental stress is extreme in birds... MUST be avoided.

Regarding feather growth... IRN's moult once a year for a varied amount of time depending on age, environment, feed etc. So once clipped its clipped till the next moult.

You have to re-clip a bird once a year to maintain the flight capacity required, there will have to be a period of full flight during moulting (no cutting imature feathers).

I seruously support semi clipping, it maintains health, natural ability, self preservation and mental stability for those who are more independant of their owners (due to circumstance or owners not being at their demand).

Full clipping is good IF you are the kind of owner who can do everything for your pet bird and maintain a seriously good diet (no flight = much less activity).

No clipping really has no sence unless you live in an extremely large home that it can make use of those flights, or you freefly your bird outdoors now and then. Each time you read one of those "lost bird" adds realise they also believed their bird would not freak out, or try to fly through the door as you went through it.

wow.. what a rant... hope someone finds this info helpful.

Statistics are the children of lies lol... however im sure people realise that well over 75% or more of birds lost to escape, do not come back. Once out and scared, your pet bird can travel extreme distances on adrenalin regardless of its health. Once taken flight... you rarely get them back again.

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:29 pm

Hi Fah

Thanks for the great advice i did find it very helpful, i think i might go for the partial clip, i have since found a website with a good write up about wing clipping as well

http://www.featheredfinds.com.au/parrotarticles/clipyourbirdswings.html

Fah · Post by **Fah** » Sat Nov 15, 2008 6:09 am

I know her well. Its a good guide and very easy to acomplish.

You cant go wrong with partial clips at all.. thats why i always push people who are unsure to go down that path.

Glad it helped some.

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 5:00 am

Well after today i think it might be time to clip, squeak has always let me pick him up while he is out of his cage, he would just hop on my hand, for others in the house he would just keep flying away, but now hes starting doing that to me when i go near him to pick him up, doesnt try to bite or anything just keeps flying away.

kramer79 · Post by **kramer79** » Sun Nov 16, 2008 1:56 pm

After some very serious consideration I have decided to clip Kiwi's wings. The main reason is that she flies a lot inside the house and gains a lot of speed in such short distance that everytime she gets close to a window I think she will die... She did hit the window once and that was it.

Also, she is very active and having her fly around the house makes me crazy when I need to find out where she is. Today in the bathroom she flew up on the lamp and burned her foot (nothing serious, but she was licking it for a minute afterwards, and that makes you think whhat if it were something very dangerous...).

One last reason for clipping would be to improve on her taming. Right now she seems to be very independent and although she is really sweet, once in a while she gets a bad day and becomes quite aggressive. I understand a good solution to this is consistent training, but it gets really difficult when she doesn't want to and just flies away. I run after her, she gets stressed, annd a vicious cycle starts...

Any advice? I don't feel like taking her to a vet, I'd like to do it myself with my girlfriend. I admit to my lack of experience in this so your thoughts would be very much appreciated (also regarding the above reasons for clipping).

Thanks,

Andre

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:09 am

Well i got around to getting my little ones wings clipped, what a difference it has made so quick, before when he was out he would fly off every time i got near him, now even if hes a few feet away he will walk up to your finger or climb up my leg now or sit on my shoulder,

He has been a bit quiet as it was only done this afternoon but is so much calmer now and it doesnt seem to bother him much, hes still happy to play with toys in the cage or pick up things and play around when out of the cage,

Definately worth doing, i was a bit hesitant to do this before as it was his 1st wing clip, thought it would be cruel to take away flight etc, but far from it, its so much better and i can see i am going to have a lot tamer bird now,

thanks everyone for your advice on the topic

pinkdevil · Post by **pinkdevil** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 4:17 pm

Isn't it funny when you take away a birds independence how they then decide... Oh yeah, I will be your friend now!

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 5:28 pm

pinkdevil wrote:Isn't it funny when you take away a birds independence how they then decide... Oh yeah, I will be your friend now!

Yeh Pink Devil i couldnt agree more, another thing i noticed squeak has been very quiet and almost a bit sulky if you want to call it that since having his wings chopped, hasnt let a chirp out since, but i guess its just all new and will get over that bit very soon

kramer79 · Post by **kramer79** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 3:30 am

Did you do the clipping yourself? I wanted to clip Kiwi but am a bit concerned with doing it myself. I don't think she'll like that too much and I don't want to make a mess with scissors and all.

But I think taking her to the vet n the other side of town just for a clip might be more stress than just doing it at home. I can pet Kiwi, but i don't think she'll like being held while I clip her wings like in the pictures of the tutorial.

Any ideas?

leo · Post by **leo** » Thu Dec 04, 2008 10:02 pm

hi fah...its realy useful...i was thinking to get a tiel and budgie for free flight training anyway since tango has been stabilised...the vet insist me to pulled out the feather anyway as tango was start chewing the flesh after the feather finish...we detect it at very early stage when he just finish 1 of his primary feather...now the feather are growing well and the situation stabilised...next week i will be moving house, is tango hit off well with it, i might get a bigger cage for him and the smaller cage i will house budgie and tiel togethjer(babies)...

hmm, wana ask, you mean by partial clipping is clippin every alternate flight feather is it?
that kind of method was popular in local few years back, but im not sure why they all went back to the old full clipping...

can post the pic please
thanks alot

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:40 am

kramer79 wrote:Did you do the clipping yourself? I wanted to clip Kiwi but am a bit concerned with doing it myself. I don't think she'll like that too much and I don't want to make a mess with scissors and all.

But I think taking her to the vet n the other side of town just for a clip might be more stress than just doing it at home. I can pet Kiwi, but i don't think she'll like being held while I clip her wings like in the pictures of the tutorial.

Any ideas?

Hi Kramer

I took my fella to the vets, only cause i hadnt done i before and didnt want to mess it up, i had read up a lot about it and seen pics of it online, but didnt want to cut a vein or something, so i understand your concerns, but i will be doing it at home next time now that i know for sure where to cut, i would suggest having 2 people do it, 1 to hold the bird and the other to clip, just be careful as they will probably try to pull their wing away and we all know how delicate they are,

I took my little one to the vet in a small box with holes i had put in it for air, he seemed happy enough in there, but he has been hand raised and is pretty tame and settled, and he likes being held upside down and having a scratch on his stomach for a little while, so that was a bit easier clipping, It only cost me $20 at the vet and it was money i would rather spend than hurt the bird doing it for the 1st time, but as i say from now on i will be doing it at home, good luck with which ever way you decide to go.

Dolphinheart · Post by **Dolphinheart** » Fri Dec 05, 2008 6:46 pm

Hi there
i know it is late but thought i would put my 5 cents worth in - after considering the posts on this site about the debate to clip or not to clip i had my IRN clipped as she/he was not being as friendly as i would hope(mine was a second hand bird - that sounds dirty does it not but i mean owners previous to me) .
Since then Siren has come a little more freindly though it will still take heaps of work but she is coming ahead and wanting to spend more time with me and is taking heaps more interest in her environment now

.

I love this forum - ther are so many opinions and so much information - you just need time to wade thru it all -lol

Good luck anyway Kramer