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We have progress people :)

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AlphaWolf
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Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Sat Oct 26, 2013 10:39 pm

Hello everybody,
First off I broke my laptop so that was why I was not online recently. Anyways, me and Aero have been making progress :D . Not big progress but baby steps. So I can approach very close to him and even close to his cage and place food between the cage bars without flying away, only moving a bit back. He does this only when he sees the treat :). Also when I change his food and do not make eye contact he will just pace back and forth or sometimes climb around the cage but I'am working on it. Doodlebug, your singing the same song also helps a little. He still doesn't eat in front of me but I'am going to slowly work on this. Also I decided to spend more time with him by spending most of my daytime working hours with him as well as my free time :) . I'am home schooled and now decided to put my desk near her cage so she can see me working next to her. Maybe I will have a bowl of nuts and once in a while give her one. All in all he is warming up with me. I have had Aero for approx. 1 month now and I really need to clean the cage. I think I should let him fly out and then change. The bottom tray is good as I change the paper every day. But their bottom mesh needs to be removed completely and the food perch also. He is getting way way more vocal, put he only does on sound, the indian ringneck scream. When will he make other noises, maybe some chirps or something. Oh and it is official. AERO IS A DUNKER!!! He just loves it, maybe for him it is pelletucular chemistry lol. He dunks the occasional red pellet but also the green one to make green water. And of course the seeds and what not.
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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InTheAir
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by InTheAir » Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:58 pm

Congratulations, that's great news. (About the bird, not the laptop).
Aren't ringnecks just so cute when they are making soup?
We picked up my little girl yesterday and I'm looking forward to watching her relax more and get comfortable with us. She's so pretty, it's so hard not to stare at her colours all day.

AlphaWolf
Posts: 289
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:46 am

Hi Claire,

Can't wait for squidgette warms upto you. So I redesigned my full bedroom today, and spent it all cleaning (don't we all do :D). So I moved Aero's cage half a metre to the left and into a corner, which I presume makes them feel much more secure. Also as I sat on my bed emptying my bedside table, Aero jumped to the closest cage wall, hanged there and stayed there watching me with shining curious little eyes. So I used his attention to my advantage, and I showed him all my stuff, song a little and talked so much. It was so nice to see him being interested in me. We are out of stock in apples, so I gave him so far, slices of kiwi, orange, nectarine, plum, banana( which he really hates) and carrots. I have yet to introduce fruit/veggies to his diet but I will soon. Is now a good time to let him out. And what shall I do so he can go out and return on his own. I don't think I can catch him if he escapes. I'am really in need in removing that dirt grill underneath and giving his perch a good clean-up! So far so good, I'am so happy with these little baby steps.
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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ellieelectrons
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Location: Sunshine Coast, Queensland, Australia

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by ellieelectrons » Sun Oct 27, 2013 3:38 pm

Hi Alphawolf

Well done on making progress. Any step in the right direction is progress. Congratulations to you for your patience and persistence.

An idea for letting your bird out to clean the cage is:
1) limiting the area that she can fly into (eg. just your bedroom with the door shut)
2) having perches for her to land on
3) do it in the afternoon allowing enough time for you to clean her cage just before the sun goes down. Allow the room to get dark naturally and hopefully she will climb into her clean cage of her own accord before it gets dark. If this technique works, you could try letting her out more often.
4) stock her cage up with cool treats to encourage her inside.

Ellie.

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Doodlebug
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Location: Suffolk, UK

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by Doodlebug » Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:57 am

Welcome back Alpha and Aero :)

Glad its all going well, the more time we spend with them the better :)

What sort of cage is it? Some unclip from the main part at the bottom, my first one did but the new large one has a slide out tray and grill for easy changing.

I am enjoying feeding different fruits and veggies to Doodlebug, to see what he likes. He doesn't like raw carrot but does like them cooked. He loves to destroy corn on the cob but don't know if he eats it or not! The same with Pomegranate. He is not keen on plum, likes Braeburn apples but not Granny Smiths. He is very fussy! He likes pasta in small quantity, and scrambled egg.

He also is quite partial to a cup of tea and helps himself to one or two of my fingers as a tasty treat. :shock:
Loo :)

MissK
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Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by MissK » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:22 pm

Alpha, I noticed that many times my bird makes his decision on how he feels about a certain food based on presentation. Banana example - only wants it hanging on the skewer. Loves it there. Doesn't know it exists anywhere else except from my fingers. Come to think of it, he only wants his leaves hanging up too..... I think we may have a pattern! :lol: But, for citrus fruits he wants them on the floor, so maybe not.

Switch it around and see if Aero has an opinion.
-MissK

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InTheAir
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by InTheAir » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:20 pm

Nila likes things arranged and cut certain ways, but Squidgette goes for anything new in her bowl. She even got straight into the coloured pellets the vet convinced me to buy (so I can tell by poo colour how much pellets she's eating).

AlphaWolf
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:03 am

Hello everyone,
So I'am going to update the progress with Aero. So after the vet visit Aero's progress went down and we were back a few baby steps. Now as you might know I began spending all day in the same room, working, using the computer and eating. So far aero has begun eating in the same room as I as long as I don't look at him. If I do he stops eating. Also Aero is beginning to stretch more and more next to my presence, scratching and ruffling his feathers. My desk is one metre to his right ( he is in the corner) so I turned the iMac screen on home and played some bowie video. He jumped to the closest wall and watched. Today I was away all morning and afternoon, so I went upstairs with a bowl of chopped pear ( for me :D ) and a slice for Aero. When I entered the room Aero showed a lot of curiosity, bending he neck and didn't even move when I gave him his slice. Do you think he is beginning to like me? He still paces furiously and jumps from wall to perch when I change his food and water. Earlier this week he used to pce for 15 minutes just to grab a morsel of seed mix, and that was without looking at him, I really believe he is improving. So what do you reckon I do now. He doesn't eat whilst I'am looking at him. Or shall I move closer to his cage and start reading. You guidance is needed, again :).
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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InTheAir
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by InTheAir » Wed Nov 06, 2013 4:07 pm

That's great!
I would only move closer if he makes the first overtures. If he moves towards you move yourself a tiny bit closer, if he is leaning away stay back.
As far as the food and water changing goes, I think it is worth trying to come to an understanding on that. With Squidgette, it was literally taking me about 5 minutes to change one dish a week ago. Then I'd come back later and change the other one.
I think it's really important to avoid any kind of big reaction, no one thinks properly when they are panicking. I am not sure how much a parrot rationalises the scenario afterwards and realises that all the panicking lead to more food, I suspect that connection would take a long time and encourage the behaviour to stay the same.

I suggest having a spare dish, so all you have to do is take one out, put the fresh one in and leave the room so he can immediately investigate it without worrying about you.
Warn him you are coming, let him find a nice safe perch, keep your focus on the dish you are intending to change and try to stay as far away from his safe place as you can. As you are approaching try to gauge how close he is to flight without actually looking at him directly (this is the hard bit), if he is thinking about taking off, stop and turn your head away from him (I was actually trying to keep my back half turned to her the whole time when I could). You may be able to hear a little rustle when he relaxes again. When he seems to have settled try another step. I think if he starts to jump around the best thing is to back off until he is comfortable. I like to explain what I am doing, even though she doesn't understand me... It just makes me feel good.
When you have finished and the bird is still staying still slowly leave the room while he is calm.
I'd really appreciate (if you do try this) if you could let me know how it goes, I'm trying to figure out how effective this method is, and how much is just a fluke that Squidgette is starting to accept me.

I hope that's helpful.

AlphaWolf
Posts: 289
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:56 am

Hello everyone,
Thank you Claire for your tips. I guess my new aim is to make my aeronaut to stay still while changing his food. Any other tips as tbh I didn't understand the post correctly (I think I might have to sleep, swimming at dawn in my swimming pool when it was freezing cold maybe messed up my system :D ) I actually never though that my giving him food after he panics might mke him think to continuo to do it. Ok so Aero is now becoming more confident in eating with me being in close proximity to him. He is also grinding like crazy which I guess is a good sign. Today I had to go shopping so I left him a full re-run of MotoGP, hope he liked it.

One thing I noticed however which made me really worried was that Aero was stretching took much. He spend the day sleeping, eating, stretching or sleeping. I'am worried sick that he might be bored. I really want to let him fly around as he still never left his cage. But I'am worried as I cannot catch him and return him to his cage. I'am in crossroads. The two techniques that I know are: 1) Remove his food at bed time. At early morning make a bowl of his favourite treats. Then after he burns so steam and explores a little, I make a trial of food and fill his cage with food. 2) I let him fly around at around 1 hour before dark and hope that he returns to his "home" at night. Also shall I open the cage from the top or from the cage door as opening and closing is very hard. Another thing is I have no play stand or play gym. I could;t find in my area so I'am saving supplies to make one out of PVC. What first, a training stand or a awesome play gym. Which has a high priory.

Ok about the boredom issue. Aero has two toys which he NEVER EVER USED. Unfortunatley there are now good toys in out area and I have never DIYed before. So I made a paper with cuts i the bottom and ripped it in front of him. however still Aero didn't use it and I really want to destroy something, anything.

Sorry for the long looooong post, but I really want Aero to form a bond with me.
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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InTheAir
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by InTheAir » Sat Nov 09, 2013 2:38 pm

Sorry, I'm not great with words.
This might explain it better:
http://learningparrots.com/blog/trainin ... l-parrots/

He doesn't need to stay still, just ensure he's not getting near the panic point. The first video I shared of Squidgette was in the morning while she is running around her cage, no matter whether I am in the room or not. You can see her pause to think about the apple before deciding to come and grab it.
As soon as she realised I was listening to her and backing off when she felt frightened, she started looking at me in a different light. She just seemed to realise I was a rational being one day and suddenly everything got easy.

Can you give him some safe branches with leaves to shred in his cage for entertainment? I find my birds play with them more than bought toys.

As far as the play stand, aero will probably want to be nice and high at first. If you have some nice curtain rails he can hang out on, he probably won't mind the lack of playstand.

I will let someone else answer the returning to the cage question, I have never tried with a bird that doesn't step up or respond quickly to bribes.
All I have to say is: Make Sure you Don't need to go out Later That Day! Trying to get a parrot to do something when you have a deadline never works for me! Even Nila has made me late for work a couple times when he was younger. And Squidgette foiled the plan I had of going to look at a potential parrot club meeting room with Ellie last week! :mrgreen:

Have you tried putting bird safe branches with leaves in his cage? both our birds like shredding them and stripping bark more than they like bought toys.

MissK
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Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by MissK » Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:25 pm

Does Aero have a food he just loves SO MUCH? Can you try putting it in a dish and then placing the dish in the cage to train him to come running when you give that bowl? If you can, that would be his motivation to come back to the cage. Note, he would have to be running for it in the cage before you would rely on him to recognize it outside the cage and still come. Sorry this was my only thought so late at night and me so tired.
-MissK

AlphaWolf
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Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:49 am

Hi,
@Claire-Thank for the link. I used to believe that awarding the calm behaviour was actually negative reinforcement. Unfortunately all woods near my area are toxic or not suitable. Also Aero is in a temporary cage for a while as I save up for a much bigger cage. The cage is large enough that he can navigate with his tail clear. However I cannot remove the dowels. Is there any online place where you can get long perches. Unfortunately I have no curtain rails however I have a enormous wardrobe, however I'am scared that if Aero walks on the roof of it I won't be able to reach him. It;s really high. I'am thinking of throwing some toys on a little rug and let him play. Unfortunately Aero is clipped so he can't fly :(

@MissK- I don't really know at the meantime because he just started eating in front of me, however I suspect it might be sunflower seeds or apples.

So today I realised that maybe I was rushing too fast. So I went to change his food bowl slowly and it took me 2 minutes. Aero doesn't panic but jumped from perch to cage bars then jumps back to the perch, runs and onto the cage wall again. However this time he improved and I noted the distance where he became uncomfortable. So I changed his food and left the room like you told me. When I returned 5 minurtes later to change the water I found Aero with one foot on the food bowl and one foot on the perch. He saw me enter the room and he stayed there watching me. As I came closer and closer he still didn't move, he he flew up to his perch and went to the side and stayed there. I wish I had a treat to give him. I came so close to him and I'am so happy. I left the room for 5 mites but when I tried to change the floor Aero became a bit uncomfortable and that stupid tray jammed. Ugh, he got a little scared. Also he started resting on foot whilst I'am close to him.


P.S. If aero is scared he reacts like beans in this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QIGq2rxc5U
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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InTheAir
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Re: We have progress people :)

Post by InTheAir » Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:52 pm

It's good that Aero is starting to eat in front of you. Squidgette was a constantly flying version of that video.
For a few days I was considering the possibility that I would fail to get her accustomed to being a house bird! I was thinking about rehoming her to an aviary.
When she realised I wasn't approaching her and I was just focused on putting food in the bowl, and was backing off when she was freaking out, she started looking at me with that calculating look they get. The next day she was looking at the treat and then to the bowl as I approached with a treat. Like "come on, put it there so I can devour it". A few days later she was snatching the treat as it was going in to the bowl. I always talk lots in general, so I have a verbal conversation and she watches my body language and answers with her eyes and body. She definitely knows what "tweet tweet want treat treat?" means already lol
I don't know if the above was actually helpful. As I said, I talk lots. :lol:
I can tell her favourite treats by looking at what is gone from her bowl in a few minutes.

I only know of australian shops. I really like the parrot society of Australia, you have to be member to order stuff, I think. It's worth it though, the prices are pretty good and the bi-monthly magazine generally has some great articles. The only thing is their website doesnt have an order form yet (don't hold your breath for it to come soon either), so you have to email them. I got my order within a few days.
The parrot rescue centre sells perches, some of their stuff is a little on the pricey side. I don't know if perches and stuff can be sent overseas though.

AlphaWolf
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Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:06 am

Re: We have progress people :)

Post by AlphaWolf » Tue Nov 12, 2013 12:18 pm

Hello Guys,
Ok I'am so happy. Aero made another noise, Kind of like a chirping sound and little quite mumbling. He did it only once though. Unfortunately he recently became very skittish but he has started preening in front of me and sleeping on one leg and constantly grinding. Sorry for asking again but I would like to know the best technique so Aero can remain calm whilst I change his food and bowl. So here is the present scenarios
:

{I go to change the water or food. As I approach aero paces along his sleep perch quickly and rapidly. If I get even closer he would jump to the walls and start jumping from place to place but not really in a panic form. Once, and that was before yesterday) he let me change his water without even flinching only watching curiously. } So what should I do to stop this. Also his water bowl is closer to me than his food bowl. Do you think it is a good idea for me to swap the food bowl.
"Live with parrots and you learn to panic"

AlphaWolf

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