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Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio. I don't have Saddlebacks or ADPs or Spangles. However, my advice from one who does have saddlebacks is that the saddle is subsumed by psitticins in the adult bird, just as it is in Turquoise birds when they on occasion start life with a saddle. Having said that, I note from the SA site hos...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio and Chris Those underwing photo are really interesting. Nathan Harris and I and others were using underwings to try to identify Turquoise in combination with other things that made it hard to see. We also suspected it might be possible to distinguish Turquoise from Indigo using underwing si...

Mikesringnecks

EmeraldTurquoise is green to look at. I have an EmeraldTurquoise Cleartail hen and she is a green colour on top and yellow underneath. I can send you photos but you will need to send me your E-mail address because I have to reduce photos to nearly nothing to send them on this site, my address is hel...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Chewbacca A Blue hen with a Green cock will only produce Green chicks , unless the cock is split for something in the sex linked line like ino, cinnamon, pallid etc. If he is carrying a sex linked mutation it will show up in half of the female chicks. If he is split for Blue then half the chicks ...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio and Johan This seasons chicks from my TurquoiseEmerald Cleartail hen have now fledged and coloured up sufficiently to be certain of their phenotype. There are 5 EmeraldBlue and 5 TurquoiseBlue. There are no BlueBlue and no TurquoiseEmerald unfortunately. Last season there were 5 EmeraldBlue...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Shaun
If it is Creamino then the mother would have to be split for Turquoise (Pastel) if the father is Blue. I would not have expected Cinnamon to give you clear flights but from memory my Creaminos did have clear flights so I reckon that is the best bet.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Scott BluePastelEmerald is not possible you can only have any two of them in one bird. If the cock is Blue Pied then the chick will certainly have a Blue gene and either a Pastel gene or an Emerald gene to go with it. If the hen is Cinnamon it won't show in the chick unless the cock is split for ...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio
Just as a matter of passing/limited relevance there was discussion with Willy on another forum regarding the fact that Violet and Emerald seem to interact visibly quite differently (unexpectedly) as compared to Dark and Emerald.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi
I have done some reading and I am wrong. Apparently The Cinnamon gene does slightly enhance the trace of melanin remaining in a Lutino phenotype so it can be visible in a Lutino Cinnamon and more so as it gets older.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi
I may be wrong, but I thought Cinnamon turned melanin (grey family pigments) to brown. On the other hand, Lutino removes all melanin from the feathers so there is nothing left for Cinnamon to change to brown. Net result, a Lutino bird should mask Cinnamon I would think.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio, Johan I have the results of my EmeraldTurquoise CleartailCleartail hen's season. Last year 5 Emerald and 2 Turquoise no Blue Blue or EmeraldTurquoise. This season she was paired to a VioletGreen; BlueBlue; CleartailCleartail cock and they produced 2 clutches of 5 chicks. The first clutch c...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Duris This late in the season I would simply pair up those that seem to be getting on well together and not worry too much about the colour of the outcomes. I can help you with the genetics in due course if others don't get you sorted with the genetic calculator. I too am from NSW and by now all ...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio Thanks very much for that background, I hadn't heard about Deon's results. I have a 2 year old TurquoiseEmerald Cleartail hen photo attached and she has never been patchy, even as a juvenile, just as you suggest it should be. Her psitticin expression is quite strong as you can see in the ph...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio I will be pairing Emerald Cleartails to each other next season with a little luck. Probably VioletGreen; EmeraldBlue; CleartailCleartail cock to a DarkGreen; EmeraldBlue; CleartailCleartail hen (I am assuming emerald is a par blue until I can prove otherwise). Are you suggesting that I will...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio
Will do. Last clutch of potential emeralds is just starting to hatch. Mother is EmeraldBlue split Cleartail and father is Violet TurquoiseBlue Cleartail so unfortunately there are quite a range of possible outcomes which makes picking emerald effects difficult.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan In the first photo I sent you can just see the back of the youngest chick of the 5 on the bottom left. It looks to be a darker pink than the other 4 and I thought that was probably because it was a lot younger than the others (3 days). I have just ringed the other 4 and the youngest still h...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan Both my experienced EmeraldBlue hens had 5 eggs in the first clutch but only 1 Emerald in each clutch. They both had 5 again in the second clutch and I am anticipating that the Emerald odds should improve. I will therefore have a very careful look at skin tones in the second nest of the fir...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan Photos taken as promised from side in nest box with flash. Mother TurquoiseEmerald CleartailCleartail father VioletGreen BlueBlue CleartailCleartail. The youngest is visible in the second photo in the middle of the pile about 1 day old. The previous clutch under a tame foster mother compris...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan Thanks a bunch for that, I actually understood it this time. Do you have any idea if the complete loss of psitticin patchiness in young birds when TurquoiseEmerald emerges has any genetic meaning/significance? Fifth chick hatched last night so I will take photos of the clutch today. Only on...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio Read the Terry reference thank you so now understand that the complementation terms are used to define some as yet unexpected and unexplained outcome in the phenotype. The only weird outcome I have so far seen with Emerald is the EmeraldTurquoise outcome where the expected psitticin patchin...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio Thanks very much for the response. I will keep hoping that my emeralds are something more than simple alleles of blue for a bit longer. However, I don't understand anything about complementation so I will have try and learn something about it presumably from the reference you gave. I can en...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan I'm afraid I don't really know anything about regulation of enzyme production, I'll have to find a reference somewhere. As to Blue1 and Blue2 are they not at different Loci and if so how can one have Blue1Blue2 which, written like that, surely places them at the one locus. I'm afraid I have...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio I have been thinking again. I agree with you that the possibility of a close linkage between Emerald and Blue would effectively negate the chance of proving EmeraldBlue by breeding my TurquoiseEmerald hen with a BlueBlue cock. However, as I have said before, surely anything other than Emera...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Ben
Thanks for that, I'd love to but I'm fairly useless at navigating around face book, its all a bit hit and miss for me.
kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Ben I forgot the details of the chick Aaron bred. Mother was a Violet Blue Cleartail and father was Violet Green/Emerald/Cleartail. What were the father's parents? I am asking with a view to somehow being certain that the father can't be Violet Emerald Green/Blue/Cleartail which is what those who...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio
Sorry silly question, of course it has to be if we are talking about an adjacent locus.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio
If Emerald is linked closely to blue then should we assume it is also closely linked to Turquoise which exists at the same locus as Blue?
kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio
I think you have given me a long term breeding project. I will try for a DF Emerald Cleartail next season and then pair it to a Green Cleartail. That way I can at least get a very good look at both the green and yellow plumage in a Green bird split for Emerald
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio Now I have finally thought it through and you are as usual correct. If my TurquoiseEmerald hen is in fact Emerald TurquoiseBlue, and the Emerald gene is closely linked to the Blue gene, then nearly all the chicks will be either Emerald BlueBlue or TurquoiseBlue when she is paired to a BlueB...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan When/if the EmeraldTurquoise Cleartail hen's second clutch have all hatched, I will try photographing them from the side in the box presumably with a flash. If it works, I can send pics directly to you if this site doesn't work for me. They will all be cleartails and I don't know whether or...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio My EmeraldTurquoise Cleartail hen has now finished laying. First 5 eggs are now all ringed chicks under a foster, the second 5 are all fertile and she will be raising them herself. It may be some time before I am certain what all 10 are genetically because Turquoise took quite a log time to...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio & Johan I put a UV light in a nest box this evening with a clutch of 5 very young chicks from an EmeraldBlue split Cleartail hen and a Violet TurquoiseBlue Cleartail cock. The chicks are under tame fosters but too young to take out and photograph in a dark room in case they get cold. Ob...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan All mine are raised by parents or fosters so taking pics of very young chicks is difficult as I gain access via a door at nest height on the side of the box. I cannot take pics of a clutch from above without removing the clutch from the nest and I am not inclined to do that before they have...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio The 2 relevant clutches I have both have Emerald and Turquoise in the parents. One is my EmeraldTurquoise Cleartail hen paired with a Violet Blue Cleartail cock and the other is an EmeraldBlue split cleartail hen paired with a Violet TurquoiseBlue Cleartail cock. I will let you know what th...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio I have blue series Emerald Cleartail chicks so I will have a look. I'm afraid I don't have any Green series Emeralds this season so for me the hunt for green splits will have to wait. Having said that, my EmeraldTurquoise Cleartail hen has 5 chicks under fosters and another clutch on the wa...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Amy Mature IRNS either have all red beaks or red top and black bottom beaks depending on the amount of eumelanin (grey family pigments) in the mutation. Juvenile birds often have quite a bit of black in the top mandible that changes to red as they get older. I don't recall ever seeing a bird with...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Ben To my eye the yellow pigmentation in those first two birds looks far too strong for a single emerald gene. To get that shade of yellow in a Dom Pied, or anything else for that matter, opens up several possibilities including DF Emerald, IndigoEmerald, TurquoiseEmerald and possibly no emerald ...

Mikesringnecks

If it is showing green in some areas that will be yellow pigment interacting with the blue which means it will be IndigoBlue or TurquoiseBlue. If it is also cinnamon it will have brown pigmentation in the flights rather than grey and it will be a TurquoiseBlue Cinnamon.

Mikesringnecks

Hi Whimsicalwings Who ever told you that you would get Blue and Violet Blue offspring from that combination is correct. However, Dilutes are rather rare in Australia and, whilst I haven't seen a Violet Blue Dilute, I am pretty certain it would not be white. Rather a pale form of Violet Blue with dar...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Twubby Definitely not Cinnamon Grey Green. I have a mature pet one, they were once called Golden Olive which is a reasonable colour descriptor but useless as a genetics based name. They are a very dark sort of "golden olive" yellow colour underneath and duller version of the same thing ...

Mikesringnecks

lovely bird and particularly nice photography Madas. Kind regards Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Kappa As I recall the story, when Willy sent Deep feathers to Mutavi for microscopic analysis the response was "no different to Cobalt". If the feathers were actually analyzed, that result would mitigate against the violet variant theory. The breeding results also work against the viole...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Johan
Is that what the very dark beak is about? I did ask the breeder (Paul COURT) about that and a couple of dark feathers on each shoulder but he couldn't shed any light on it other than to tell me that both parents came from JS.
Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi ErnieisAwsome Molossus knows what he is talking about and is therefore probably correct looking at the photo above . I only have one green, a rising one year old split opaline but the single opaline gene should not affect the colour. I have tried to attach library photos of him but if it doesn't ...

Mikesringnecks

Hi ErnieisAwsome
It guess it could be camera, computer or lighting but that lovely green chick looks too dark to me to be a simple green bird. What were the parents?Kind regards
Mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Recio I have an experience very similar to eleetronics except that my hen does hatch eggs and raise chicks. She is brilliant mother but fiercely defends the nest once it contains eggs. In the off season, she wants to be stoked and hand fed, whilst in the breeding season I have to enter her breedi...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Lee
I have trouble getting them to face the correct way even when I catch them and put them in a photo cage. I sometimes sit there for ages trying to get the shot I need. Thanks again in advance.
Kind regards
mike

Mikesringnecks

Hi Lee Thank you very much for taking the time to take and post photos. The difference between EmeraldBlue and green series undertails in your alexandrines looks exactly like my IRN cleartails, in other words pale cream vs bright yellow. Sorry about one more question, but does the undertail of your ...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Martin Thank you so much for the response, pity it wasn't the "dusty" issue but very interesting nonetheless. Like you, I haven't retained a Dark TurquoiseBlue but I did breed some and I have attached a couple of photos. However, this site doesn't like posting my photos, so they may not...

Mikesringnecks

Hi Lee
Can you please simply tell us what the different undertail yellow pigmentation looks like in a wildtype alexandrine, an Emerald green alexandrine and your Emerald Blue alexandrine.
Kind regards
Mike

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