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Search found 597 matches

by trabots
Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: I quit
Replies: 7
Views: 647

Re: I quit

Recio, you are disrupting, you are not nearly as smart as you think you are, you are a complete fool in my opinion. Why not keep your yap shut until you have birds in the hand. I am deleting all correspondence I ever had with your sorry self.
And to pre-empt, this is what I sent Recio.
by trabots
Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:39 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: I quit
Replies: 7
Views: 647

Re: I quit

Johan you can stick those feathers where the sun don’t shine. Your father would be ashamed of you.
That is the total email sent to Johan. All the education in the world does not make one a true scientist. Like many pseudo scientists you have exaggerated your data.
by trabots
Mon Nov 25, 2013 2:46 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: I quit
Replies: 7
Views: 647

I quit

While there are pseudo scientist types on this or any other forum who don't appreciate plain simple logic to anything put forward, who agree on the plan required to prove something, then when the results don't fit their fixed model, they hit you with the what ifs, the idiotic hypotheticals and are p...
by trabots
Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:35 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Green Opaline Pied
Replies: 18
Views: 2359

Re: Green Opaline Pied

Johan, do me a big favour and just answer me in the other thread.
by trabots
Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:34 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue
Replies: 15
Views: 2508

Re: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue

I don't have a Blue series Emerald sorry.
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:07 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Green Opaline Pied
Replies: 18
Views: 2359

Re: Green Opaline Pied

How can you say that Ben when you haven't explored the alternate hypothesis that Opaline and Harlequin are just variants of the same mutation? Recio, Johan??
:wink:

I forgot something
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Your birds seem to be BlueBlue SF Emeralds and ParblueBlue SF Emeralds. Recio, same thing, how can a bird with psitticins be Blue? You are evading the obvious as I think you are smart enough not to overlook the obvious. I wonder however. I'll try again and this is the last time I will enter into an...
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:41 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Green Opaline Pied
Replies: 18
Views: 2359

Re: Green Opaline Pied

When you breed one Opaline hen then you have confirmation of the pied being Opaline. Accept the fact that Harlequins have a head same as Opaline How can you say that Ben when you haven't explored the alternate hypothesis that Opaline and Harlequin are just variants of the same mutation? Recio, Joha...
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:54 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I think that Chris bird is a DF Emerald in blue series
Recio, lets now progress. How is Chris' df Emerald a Blue series when it clearly has psitticins? Just answer this please then to the next step.
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:46 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Yes Stefan, I accept I am wrong, I have just started CHCT breeding and only had TurquoiseBlue CHCT to relate, none of them have patches. My argument still stands however that you can't make conclusions about what a Parblue is or isn't by using only CHCT versions for reference.
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:43 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I am fed up with you both Johan and Recio for time and again ignoring basic genetics of what a bird can and can't be with regard to the heterozygous Emerald. The df Emerald is Green series (or Blue according to you) needs no discussion at this stage. The other far more common heterozygous Emerald th...
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:57 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Indigo thread
Replies: 15
Views: 1715

Re: Indigo thread

These two chicks show df Indigo and IndigoBlue in the nest.Image
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:24 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Great pics Mike, it would seem I am wrong about at least those CHCT with Violet. Your TurquoiseBlue CHCT has a much more blended in affect on his back. Your young EmeraldTurquoise CHCT shows an even distribution.
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:03 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Johan you are saying 'what if' Aaron's split Emerald cock is in fact a Green Emerald. Surely John Friske who bred the bird from an EmeraldBlue would have noticed a different phenotype in the Green bird, enough that would justify the bird being a SF Emerald? This is what I am getting at, so much BS b...
by trabots
Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:43 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Willy, where does the underlined fit in? On the basis that all alleles of the same locus found in any parrot so far are always of the same inheritance mode Johan, Recio is saying Emerald is dominant but at the Blue locus also. There so far as I am aware only sex-linked and recessive allelic mutatio...
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 8:34 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Your female is thus Wild Green/Turquoise SF Emerald, with the Emerald allele linked to the wild allele of the Blue locus. Recio, this is your conclusion so let's pair this bird with a Blue as Mike did. SF Emerald /Turquoise x Blue = 25% Green /Blue 25% TurquoiseBlue 25% SF Emerald /Blue 25% SF Emer...
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 6:24 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Thanks for the images Mike. Recio you have based your theory on the appearance of Mike's EmeraldTurquoise CHCT without even mentioning CHCT. You fail to appreciate the changes CHCT does to a TurquoiseBlue. The CHCT partially eliminates the patches, it is an more even coloured bird on the back than w...
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:55 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I am now by no means confident that I could detect a low level of pastel yet in either the Violet EmeraldBlue or the Violet Cobalt Emerald Cleartails. What do you mean by "pastel" Mike? If you mean the patches on a TurquoiseBlue you won't see them on a CHCT. Please show us an image of the mother Tu...
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:47 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

What I see is a mainly Green bird without any patch.
Recio, what bird are you looking at? If it is the bird Mike posted on 21 November, the one that is "mainly green" then that is not the mother of Mike's CHCT chicks. That bird is clearly not a CHCT. Both of the parents were CHCT.
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:34 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Mike, what is the bird in the image you posted on 21 November? Have you ever posted an image of your TurquoiseEmerald CHCT hen?
by trabots
Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:23 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue
Replies: 15
Views: 2508

Re: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue

Recio, the EmeraldBlue is as you have seen, total body fluorescent. The TurquoiseBlue and IndigoBlue fluoresce only on the patched psitticins. The IndigoBlue fluoresces the least.
by trabots
Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:04 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Feathers
Replies: 97
Views: 5017

Re: Feathers

My tail feather collection proved invaluable when identifying my young structural mutants while taking blood for sexing. I always pull the breeders' primary tail feathers after their young wean when I catch them up to put into the big summer flight. That is why the tips are sometimes missing, they a...
by trabots
Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:00 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Mike, I don't quit so easily. If you could explain where the below fails scientific method we might all learn something. By the way I am a Mechanical Engineer, Bsc University of Calgary 1978. Far more than opposing view points is my annoyance at those who have a lot to say but when pressed to qualif...
by trabots
Fri Nov 22, 2013 8:32 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Aaron's single chick simply does not constitute application of good scientific method. We start by assuming that the green parent has an emerald gene at the blue locus along with a wildtype gene at the other site, a fact which I take as proven Willy. However, the fact that a single chick is produce...
by trabots
Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:11 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue
Replies: 15
Views: 2508

Re: Photo Comparisons-Emerald V Other Parblue

EmeraldBlue, TurquoiseBlue, IndigoBlue

Image
by trabots
Fri Nov 22, 2013 5:42 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

What we have here on this thread is a detailed argument hell bent on uncovering the true nature of this beast Yes, but at some point when the answer has been confirmed by the breedings which we all discussed a year ago, the argument has to logically stop. Nobody expressed concern with those breedin...
by trabots
Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:03 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

It is my view that it is possible, albeit highly unlikely, that a gene could appear at an as yet unidentified locus to create emerald yellow by either pigment or structural means. It is not unheard of for new mutations, that haven't been identified in other species, to show themselves in ringnecks....
by trabots
Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:56 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emerald underwing patches
Replies: 8
Views: 730

Re: Emerald underwing patches

Come on Lee, you can't just say you bred something weird without telling us what the parents were and provide an image of the bird.
by trabots
Thu Nov 21, 2013 10:51 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Recio said Willy's logics (very correct) is that if BlueBlue is present it is not possible to see any psittacin. Since this bird show psittacins it would mean that it is a parblue. This logic is sound whenever we are dealing with a single Blue locus, Recio unless there is another Blue locus you agre...
by trabots
Wed Nov 20, 2013 7:06 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Cheers Mike, if there is ANY yellow on the bird it CANNOT be a Blue bird.
by trabots
Wed Nov 20, 2013 6:56 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emerald underwing patches
Replies: 8
Views: 730

Re: Emerald underwing patches

Mike, you had me worried but here they are, all Emeralds not CHCT or anything else and from different clutches. If you are talking about real yellow spots then that is a different issue. I am confirming that you can tell a Violet EmeraldBlue or any other Blue coloured bird if it is Emerald by lookin...
by trabots
Wed Nov 20, 2013 3:21 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Help with Genetic Calulator
Replies: 3
Views: 263

Re: Help with Genetic Calulator

I have a Green/Blue/Ino and a Grey Green hen, can someone tell me the out come. Green/Blue/Ino x Grey Green = cocks 50% Green poss split Blue and poss split Ino 50% Grey Green poss split Blue and poss split Ino hens 25% Green poss split Blue 25% Grey Green poss split Blue 50% Lutino poss Grey Green...
by trabots
Wed Nov 20, 2013 7:17 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Recessivity and masking ... the same phenomenon?
Replies: 14
Views: 934

Re: Recessivity and masking ... the same phenomenon?

No doubt the wild birds were grey Could you follow their logics to describe an inheritance pattern to blue, cobalt, mauves and albinos birds? So there are Dark, Ino and other genes as well but they survive barely and will eventually die out because the non-Grey phenotypes aren’t as well camouflaged...
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 4:04 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

Hopefully you'll agree that there is some logic to the green series emerald breeding program on the premise that emerald is a parblue. Johan, long before you have bred the Green /Emeralds for your breeding program I will have bred guaranteed df Emeralds simply by pairing EmeraldBlues. I have 100% c...
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:58 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Mike and Ringo hi. I have bred some violet blue that I assume to be emerald due to its emerald like flourescense ... yet appear completely blue. Is it possible that emerald in blue series are completely (visually) devoid of Psittacin ... Willy your input is what I am particularly interested in... L...
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:45 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Recessivity and masking ... the same phenomenon?
Replies: 14
Views: 934

Re: Recessivity and masking ... the same phenomenon?

We aren't gurus. The only gurus I have come across are Terry and Deon. We are amateurs with some pretending to be scientists.
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 5:38 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I have many other interests in my life than to read all about all the possible science which affects other creatures. This is an IRN forum and this thread is being used to discuss a second Blue alllele in budgerigars. Not interested. Why the commentary about yellow under the wing of a Violet Emerald...
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:36 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Johan, why make it so hard to understand? When I talk structure I talk about what makes a parrot feather Blue, full stop. And when I talk about feather fluorescence I talk about what we know from parrots, some psitticins fluoresce not blue colours. I am sure it is all very interesting stuff but why ...
by trabots
Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:27 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

Bravo Johan. Apology accepted. There is no place for sarcasm on this forum and I am allergic to it. Ask Recio. I was guilty of it sometimes on Terry's forum but I was truly exasperated at the posts by the Mad Cow and the Caveman and yet silence from Terry who could have stifled it, not with repriman...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:24 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

the great value of Aaron's chick lies in the fact that we know for certain that its green parent is split for emerald Mike if you agree with your own statement you must agree that Emerald is not dominant or the parent would not be Green. A bird cannot be split for a dominant mutation. I already poi...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:18 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Mike, further to this, the UV reflectance of the bird shows that it is a psitticin based mutation. Structure does not fluoresce.
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:33 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

It is obvious that the image is too dark from the colour of the Deep Blue chicks. This looks more realistic.
Image
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:22 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Mike, Molossus, the Grey mutation destroys all structural colour in a feather. It is odd that it still called a structural mutation but that is because it involves structure. That is why there are no blue colours in a Grey or Grey Green. If Emerald was structural logically Grey would destroy that st...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:20 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

I have not seen a mature DF indigo cock. Does the same phenotypic difference still hold, i.e. no psittacin in the neck ring (i.e. only black and white)? My mature df Indigo cock was killed by a hawk, major set back. It had a small amount of colour in the neck ring. Why should it not? The hen is all...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:12 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Now go ahead and tell me that bird has a gorget in the blue end of the spectrum. Or better yet, explain to the forum that this post is irrelevant because it isn't a ringneck. IMO this is a reflective type feather structure rather than the refractive type found in parrots. Any iridescence in parrots...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:06 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

He has 3 Deep Greens /CH Fallow now.
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:59 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.
Replies: 7
Views: 492

Re: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.

As I said I have quit this thread.
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:30 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Me too and i am not convinced it is a deep. I am sick of this doubting. Read my lips, the bird was bred from a Deep. Ron is not a stunned mullet. I will tell him that he will not be believed until he puts it with a Dark Green also, he will probably say "tell them get mated". You wonder why he doesn...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:00 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Also some split opaline males show a very slightly lighter body and some tail dilution, as another example. If a bird always shows even just a hint of aberrant colour in EVERY Greenmutant then the mutation is dominant. If as you say in Opaline where only sometimes is there 'leakage' in the heterozy...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 7:49 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Or better yet, explain to the forum that this post is irrelevant because it isn't a ringneck. Now go ahead and tell me that bird has a gorget in the blue end of the spectrum. Or better yet, explain to the forum that this post is irrelevant because it isn't a ringneck. No Johan, let's get real and s...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:42 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.
Replies: 7
Views: 492

Re: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.

Is parblue simply Blue split green John, genetically BlueGreen is the same a GreenBlue or Green split Blue. That bird has a wildtype gene sharing the Blue locus with a Blue gene. A Parblue mutation is allelic to Blue meaning it can only reside on the Blue locus. So we have TurquoiseBlue, EmeraldBlu...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:15 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Are you not assuming EmeraldBlue here again and ignoring the remote possibility of Aaron's green parent's parent being SF Emerald Blue rather than EmeraldBlue? Mike, you are persistent. I have already proved that an 'Emerald looking' bird cannot be Blue for the simple fact that Blue eliminates all ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:17 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Molossus, the Grey mutation destroys all structural colour in a feather. It is odd that it still called a structural mutation but that is because it involves structure. That is why there are no blue colours in a Grey or Grey Green. If Emerald was structural logically Grey would destroy that structur...
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 4:09 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Sheyd, no they were bred from a Deep Blue x Green CH Fallow. He has 3 Deep Greens /CH Fallow now.
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:55 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Ron has just sent me images of a Deep Green with a Green, both 100% for sure. Kappa, I don't know what to say but your bird is significantly different.

SF Deep Green, Green
Image
by trabots
Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:50 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

If the green parent of Aaron's chick is SF Emerald Green (ignoring the complicating genes) is it not possible for the chick to be SF Emerald also? Surely, the obvious additional step we have to take is a careful visual inspection of that Green parent to see if there is any sign of the influence of ...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:47 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.
Replies: 7
Views: 492

Re: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.

Due to a lack of audience participation this thread is dead. I have agreement on the logic from Recio, that is all I need.
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 10:46 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Whenever a mutation appears in one of the controled genes, this could scape to the control of the master gene, and allow to express psittacins even if Blue is present. Recio, there is proof that the Blue mutation eliminates both kinds of psitticin right in front of us. We have a wildtype Green whic...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:55 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Has anyone told Aaron that he is possibly the owner of a mythical/rare SF Emerald Green or most likely only a Green/emerald? Mike sorry I know you asked Ben but I did speak personally with Aaron also. Aaron didn't need to be told he had a Green /Emerald. He was told on acquisition that that may be ...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:50 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.
Replies: 7
Views: 492

EmeraldBlue logic bit by bit.

Recio et al here is your new thread however I have decided to work it back from my logic. Please, please save your non to the point discourses for the other threads on the subject. Here is the logic re-posted for reference. Again, the hetero. Emerald IRN we know and I have bred has come from pairing...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:58 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Grey does not destroy psitticins so Grey will not mask Emerald but combine with it Grey destroys structure. So does this not prove that Emerald is not structural? I will not take part any further. I can't resist, I have an addiction to proving the rest of you wrong. Quite a challenge however when t...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:27 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Willy: could you open a new thread and make a summary of your results from the begining? Recio et al, before my anger at the illogical that keeps on being presented here turns into tears. :x I will not take part any further. Reciio, your analysis is always the same, you throw in some possibility or...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:20 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deon's "Violino"
Replies: 11
Views: 805

Re: Deon's "Violino"

It's already done
Is this a trick answer? Respectfully Recio, but where can I find your dissection and analysis of the Parblue logic I presented?
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:55 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deon's "Violino"
Replies: 11
Views: 805

Re: Deon's "Violino"

Thanks for the correction Willy ... but the main logic remains.
As you are logic driven like me Recio, why won't you go through the Emerald logic I have offered and come to a conclusion?
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:50 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

it was me that said what if green masks Emerald If Green masks Emerald, Emerald is recessive. grey masks violet but grey and Emerald produce Emerald grey Grey destroys structural colour in case of Violet Grey however Grey does not destroy psitticins so Grey will not mask Emerald but combine with it...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:28 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

My deep green is bred from 1 of Martin's birds, and as for images, I have posted some early on in this thread. Have I bred a df deep green? I thought I did, but I am unfortunately starting to have my doubts. The chick I have was very different early on ( also posted photos in this thread) but has "...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:21 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Again, the hetero. Emerald IRN we know and I have bred has come from pairings with Blue. That said we know that they must have at least one Blue gene. The hetero. Emerald IRN has psitticin so it cannot have 2 Blue genes. The bird then is Emerald /Blue or is EmeraldBlue. If the former then we alread...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:11 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

df Turquoise, IndigoBlue, TurquoiseBlue

Image

df Indigo 15mo

Image
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 2:03 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deon's "Violino"
Replies: 11
Views: 805

Re: Deon's "Violino"

but Mike's results show that the expression of Emerald in Violet birds produces a darker Violet and not a greener bird. Mike's results are for the CHCT mutation Recio. I have bred several Violet EmeraldBlues and they are definately greener. http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/Trabots%2...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 7:11 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Blue x Green /Emerald = 50% Green /Blue 50% EmeraldBlue Mike why do you say If emerald is a par blue mutation I agree with you entirely because the parent would be EmeraldBlue not Green. when the genetics are quite clear? The hen is a Green split Emerald and will breed EmeraldBlues when bred to a B...
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:11 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deep blue ! How Deep ?

Dark Deep, Dark Violet, Dark, Dark Deep Violet Blues

Image
by trabots
Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:04 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Aaron's breeding result only provides an absolute proof if we can be 100% certain that the Green parent is not split for blue as detailed in my previous analysis. Hi Mike, the fact that the Green parent has now been proved split Emerald means it cannot be split to Blue because either way it would s...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:35 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deep blue ! How Deep ?

It may be awhile before that happens Ben, I am keeping my Cobalts separate for now. In fact as I am convinced that Cobalt is a dead end I am going to get rid of most of them. Cobalt starts destroying the structure as does a Mauve when more than 2 structural mutations are present (not counting Blue)....
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 9:23 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Hi Mike, firstly your pairs are not correct, this is what happened. They are not Ben's birds, Ben just saw the birds at Aaron's. I talked to Aaron today for 30 min. The pairing was Violet Blue CHCT x Violet Green /CHCT /Emerald, removing the irrelevant we have: Blue x Green /Emerald = 50% Green /Blu...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:37 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

To show you how difficult it is to identify sometimes, I placed a for sure Deep Blue and Deep TurquoiseBlue in with the previous bunch. There is another DF Deep Violet Blue on the left. The bird in the other image previously labelled Deep Blue is in fact a DF, it is the one on the perch. http://i130...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:22 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I will ask her about the grand parents on the mother's side to see if there is any chance of my hen being a TurquoiseTurquoise (I certainly couldn't tell from the phenotype) Hi Mike here is a TurquoiseTurquoise next to a TurquoiseBlue http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/Trabots%20IRNs/...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:39 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

It seems that it is almost pathological with some of you to prove IRN Emerald is dominant and not Parblue. Have you bet your houses on it? Every single such argument or theory put forward could just as easily been used to dispute Turquoise or Indigo. Why are they not being questioned? I have yet to ...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:08 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Kappa, thanks for the private email. It shouldn't need to be private. Ron's Deep Blue birds are the same as Martins as are mine. Only Ron has bred Deep Greens (in our little group). You say you have them? Where are your images? Have you bred a DF Deep in either Blue or Green? If you think your birds...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:58 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Please have a look at this article on structural colour in birds. This quote is the clincher: These fundamental modifications cause violet and blue light to be selectively reflected from the feather surface in the case of violet/blue feathers, while white feathers reflect all visible light. In short...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:29 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

If emerald is a parblue, why is it visible in the green series heterozygous emerald alexandrine, i.e. the green / emerald (or emerald green split or not split blue)? Johan, Molossus et al, we are talking about the Emerald mutation in IRNs NOT Alexandrines. That is a totally different beast and must...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:33 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Does the concept of emerald possibly being a structural gene necessarily mean it will be co-dominant and should we therefore be able to see some evidence of it in the green series? Mike, if a simple het. Emerald is not EmeraldBlue it is Green /Emerald (what Aaron has). A Green series bird has the B...
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:32 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

Ben, I think all these birds darken to maturity. But yes to your question.
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:30 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Please Help
Replies: 8
Views: 678

Re: Please Help

I go Grey and Cinnamon Blue
by trabots
Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:25 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

The potential outcomes from my EmeraldTurquoise hen paired to a BlueBlue (excuse my perversion of the Martin system) cock are EmeraldBlue and TurquoiseBlue my pairing can only produce EmeraldBlue chicks if emerald is a par blue gene Mike you were right the first time. EmeraldTurquoise x BlueBlue = ...
by trabots
Fri Nov 15, 2013 9:16 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Hi Mike, I am sold on Aaron's breeding of a Green bird to a non-Emerald bird and resulting in an EmeraldBlue chick. He was told by a respected breeder that the Green bird was poss split Emerald. That breeder is obviously way ahead of the rest of us and also knows that Emerald is a recessive Parblue ...
by trabots
Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:44 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

This is dark :D

DF Deep Violet TurquoiseBlue, DF Deep TurqoiseBlue, Deep Blue

Image
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:18 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

trabots wrote:
The locus is named the Blue locus however every allele that can be on that locus has equal dominance with every other gene that is possible at that locus.
Stefan it should read mutant allele
and mutant gene
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:17 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

The locus is named the Blue locus however every allele that can be on that locus has equal dominance with every other gene that is possible at that locus.
Stefan it should read mutant allele
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 3:12 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Parblues behave as codominant respective to other parblues.
Recio, that should read Parblues behave as co-dominant to other Parblues AND Blue and vice versa.
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 7:12 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

i haven't written blue birds. I wrote "blue series" birds which should read as "birds with blue base color". Sorry for confusion. But Stefan that is the point, if a bird is a Blue series it has two Blue genes at the Blue locus and that bird has nil psitticins. A bird with only one Blue gene is eith...
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:44 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

The puzzle is that homozygous parblues should be identifiable right away
By the time you need to pair them up for breeding you will know whether df Parblue or not. If this is just an exercise well have fun. If I need a df Parblue I just grab one after its second moult and breed 100% ParblueBlues.
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:39 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

if Lutino removes every melanin ... how could a SL-ino Cinnamon show any melanin? Thus lutino and cinnamon must be alleles of the same gene and not different mutations. .... so things are not that easy. Recio you have added another mutation and therefore due to x-over or whatever the relationship, ...
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:57 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

And some more "blue series" emerald alexandrines:
Stefan, how can they be Blue birds when they have obvious psitticins? These certainly look more like our EmeraldBlue IRNs.
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:54 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue
Replies: 26
Views: 1874

Re: Breeding a guaranteed homozygous parblue

However, we have no guarantees to which birds are heterozygous and which are homozygous parblues. Johan, what is the point when they are easily distinguishable, some early some not until their 2nd moult. df Turquoise, TurquoiseBlue http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/Trabots%20IRNs/Tur...
by trabots
Thu Nov 14, 2013 12:01 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

To me the pic of the emerald cock IRN posted by you earlier is a Blue Emerald Molussus, the image I have posted of an EmeraldBlue has obvious psitticin in its feathers. Yes or no? If yes it cannot be an Emerald Blue as Blue by definition removes all psitticins. If there is a Green Emerald in Alex t...
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:41 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Willy could you please elaborate on why you think that the Alex and IRN Emerald mutations are different- of images I have seen, I saw no notable differences? To me they were just like say comparing a Wildtype Alex and IRN together- looking very much the same in colour. That is my point, the Alex an...
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:19 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Shey, Ron assures me that is happening, hopefully alongside a Dark Green and a Violet Green as well.
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:36 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Great that you are a thinker Mike, like Ben said, great to have you aboard. :idea: What we keep forgetting is that the homozygous Blue mutation on its own removes ALL psitticins in each and every other mutation that we know of. Why then if Emerald is dominant does this not happen? A SF Emerald Blue...
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:34 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Thank you for the pics ... but my questions remains : is the chick nails colour darker than his father's nails? If rigth now the colour is already darker it would point to Deep as a melanistic mutation. If not yet ... let's wait and see a bit later. I have seen various shades of nail and feet colou...
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 3:27 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Molussus, the 'Emerald' Alex is very close in phenotype to a normal. I have said this before IMO this mutation is not the same as Emerald in IRNs as in that species there is a significant difference in phenotype.
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:31 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

Yes I know, just trying to excite :!: So many people claim world firsts without knowing what the rest of the world is up to. Again, the CHCT sure darkens the colours that are left. Ron confirmed this. There is theory that CHCT is another Fallow however this darkening goes against the normal Fallow a...
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 5:09 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

From Ron, world first Deep Blue CHCT.

Image
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 4:58 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Ron sent me this today. Only a phone pic, camera pics to come. Nothing like what I see in this thread.

SF Deep Green
Image
by trabots
Wed Nov 13, 2013 4:32 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Great that you are a thinker Mike, like Ben said, great to have you aboard. :idea: What we keep forgetting is that the homozygous Blue mutation on its own removes ALL psitticins in each and every other mutation that we know of. Why then if Emerald is dominant does this not happen? A SF Emerald Blue ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:27 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Gratz, don't do as I did and cut off their wings, get some help holding the wings out for an accurate comparison. Cheers.
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:24 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

I suppose the issue is whether the point the writer is trying to make is the one focused on by the person responding. Takes one to know one Johan :lol: Seriously, I don't miss the point as you surely don't either. I just hate having to type out homozygous every time I want to refer to a df Parblue....
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:16 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Well done on correcting me so graciously and missing the actual point of the post where I went through a lot of effort to attempt to answer your questions. I assume your questions have been answered. Johan, my questions were just answered by theoretical possibilities but no birds on the perch. I pr...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 9:51 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Cleartail X Dom Pied
Replies: 77
Views: 8752

Re: Cleartail X Dom Pied

Obviously I queried Ron about the Pied being split CHCT however it wasn't sold to him as that. He also says it has very small dark patches, just like a DF Pied.
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 9:48 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Paul, if this isn't an EmeraldBlue then what is? This is the standard other than there is a question about the neck ring being variable, nothing new in a Parblue. You take verbatim that it must have "UNIFORM overall colour", it is uniform only in the sense that a Green wildtype is uniform. Just as t...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 6:45 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Cleartail X Dom Pied
Replies: 77
Views: 8752

Re: Cleartail X Dom Pied

Ron has just advised me that from a Dom Pied x CHCT pairing he also got an almost white bird.
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:42 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Recio, how about this logic:

Assign a df Turquoise a psitticin level of 10

Assign a homozygous Blue a psitticin level of 0

Combine the 2 alleles and you get an average of the two or 5 as is seen in a TurquoiseBlue.

There is a valid counter to this logic.................
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:37 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: What is the mutation where body is blue tail is violet?
Replies: 148
Views: 7268

Re: What is the mutation where body is blue tail is violet?

And another, in this case the bird was a Violet Mauve

Image
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:57 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Sorry, sorry. I could have let this go as fact but after checking my records the imaged bird bred non Parblues when paired to a Blue. They bred a male NSL Albino which confirmed both parents were split NSL Ino. They were both split CHCT. So is this bird an IndigoBlue or a TurquoiseBlue? In any event...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

we should have long ago seen a compounding effect in the numerous TurquoiseIndigos which have been bred before it was realised that they were different Parblues This is your answer Recio. TurquoiseIndigos are out there for sure and they aren't noticed unless someone breeds one to a Blue which then ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 3:19 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

No such thing as a DF turquoise, so you should correct that incorrect usage as frequently as possible. :wink: Wink or otherwise Johan, I declared long ago that I would use lower case "df" for homozygous Parblues. they are still factors after all. Everyone then knows what I am talking about because ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 3:02 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

The psittacin quantity in the heteroallele TurquoiseEmerald will be in between that of either homozygotic alleles, that is between DF Turquoise and DF Emerald but we are describing TurquoiseEmerald respective to the heterozygous TurquoiseBlue, and thus, if Turquoise and Emerald were both parblues, ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 7:26 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

If Emerald was a parblue, a TurquoiseEmerald must show a deeper red ring than a TurquoiseBlue. Do we agree? I don't agree. The psitticin quantity in the heteroallele overall will be in between that of either, so a lighter neck ring IMO. If the psitticin quantity was cumulative the EmeraldTurquoise ...
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:38 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Further to this can anyone post an image of any Emerald which has a non-white ring? If there is a Green series Emerald that would be the bird.
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:18 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

If this is the case then Emerald couldn't be a even colored parblue.
Stefan, you can clearly see that the EmeraldBlue in my image has a different coloured face to the rest of its body. I think the 'even distribution of psitticin was just to differentiate from TurquoiseBlue and now IndigoBlue.
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:15 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

EmeraldBlue

Image
by trabots
Mon Nov 11, 2013 1:15 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

No one can provide a pic of an Emerald parblue adult male showing the red ring?
Sorry. I just went off your last post. An EmeraldBlue has a white ring and a TurquoiseBlue has a salmon ring so an EmeraldTurquoise will have a ring in between in colour IMO.
by trabots
Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:11 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Recio, as far as this group is aware of, there are only the 2 for sure df Emeralds in existence so far. Deon's bred by Phil and Chris'. Your analysis may have to wait for these birds to mature.
by trabots
Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:55 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Also, I'd like to point out that we should keep in mind that a mutation masked in green series and visible in blue isn't necessarily a parblue. For it to be a parblue, it needs to happen at the blue locus specifically. Johan, what heterozygous mutations which are masked in Green series but only vis...
by trabots
Sun Nov 10, 2013 3:58 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

I'd love for the /Emerald hen to be photographed with a Wildtype and with a tail comparison just 'to see'.
The /Emerald hen is a CHCT according to Ben, so a tail comparison is invalid.
by trabots
Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:48 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

The Green youngster would be split Emerald OR Blue then, not just Blue.
Wrong Willy, Ben is right, if the young received an Emerald gene it would combine with the for sure Blue gene = EmeraldBlue not /Emerald
by trabots
Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:57 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation
Replies: 199
Views: 13648

Re: Case Closed: Emerald = Parblue Mutation

Great news. The Green youngster would be split Emerald OR Blue then, not just Blue.
by trabots
Sat Nov 09, 2013 10:01 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Turquoise Violet and Turquoise df Violet nest 2013
Replies: 2
Views: 519

Re: Turquoise Violet and Turquoise df Violet nest 2013

Very interesting that the df Turquoise is so visible at fledging when combined with Violet. It is often hard to pick a df Turquoise until after their 2nd moult. Good going John.
by trabots
Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:56 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue combinations
Replies: 5
Views: 628

Re: EmeraldBlue combinations

Ben, the Emerald was from another clutch, the others have a Deep Blue sibling.
by trabots
Sat Nov 09, 2013 4:53 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep blue ! How Deep ?
Replies: 51
Views: 3695

Re: Deepblue ! How Deep ?

we were not sure if the bird from Martin was a deep blue, dark deep blue or just eu dark blue
I talked to Martin recently, he had never bred a Deep Dark Blue. You have Deep Blue (Oz Cobalt) if that was what he said it was.
by trabots
Fri Nov 08, 2013 6:06 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue combinations
Replies: 5
Views: 628

Re: EmeraldBlue combinations

Image was with a flash. The grey bucket is far better than a white one.
by trabots
Fri Nov 08, 2013 6:05 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldBlue combinations
Replies: 5
Views: 628

EmeraldBlue combinations

A bucket of 4 chicks showing all possible EmeraldBlue outcomes from an EmeraldBlue x Deep Violet Blue.

cw, Deep EmeraldBlue, Deep Violet EmeraldBlue, Violet EmeraldBlue, EmeraldBlue
Image
by trabots
Fri Nov 08, 2013 3:59 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

Chris, this is where you jump in and tell us how old are the first df Emeralds that you and Phil bred? Phil told me he sent you one but didn't realise it was df and that that is the one you sent to Deon. Phil asked me the other day how you tell and I just passed on what you have observed, that of th...
by trabots
Thu Nov 07, 2013 7:57 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Saddleback ?
Replies: 186
Views: 27155

Re: Saddleback ?

Thanks Sheyd, so simple, I am always looking for the hardest solution.

Chris, g'day too,

If Emerald is Parblue

EmeraldBlue x TurquoiseBlue =

25% Blue
25% EmeraldBlue
25% TurquoiseBlue
25% EmeraldTurquoise
by trabots
Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:02 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Saddleback ?
Replies: 186
Views: 27155

Re: Saddleback ?

Recio and Tienie, great advise which I, as one half of most arguments (me against the rest) on Terry's forum, and final winner of a couple of major topics, hope to follow on this great forum. I know, "arrogance", ignore my short comings and digest the message. Now how about a quick lesson on how to ...
by trabots
Thu Nov 07, 2013 3:33 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: DF Emeralds
Replies: 47
Views: 2839

Re: DF Emeralds

That is a great phenotypical analysis Recio. We now however have Mike's breeding of the heteroallele EmeraldTurquoise x Blue (I leave out the CHCT and the structural mutations) giving 5 EmeraldBlues and 2 TurquoiseBlues. If not Parblue we would have expected Blue birds and EmeraldTurquoise young als...
by trabots
Wed Nov 06, 2013 4:05 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: what colours ???
Replies: 5
Views: 336

Re: what colours ???

Eva, Pastel is properly TurquoiseBlue. Silver is Cinnamon Grey.
by trabots
Wed Nov 06, 2013 4:18 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: what colours ???
Replies: 5
Views: 336

Re: what colours ???

Hi, if your bird is in fact a Cinnamon Grey TurquoiseBlue x Blue you will breed: cocks 25.0% 1.0 grey(sf) blue /cinnamon 25.0% 1.0 blue /cinnamon 25.0% 1.0 grey(sf) turquoise(parblue)Blue /cinnamon 25.0% 1.0 turquoise(parblue)Blue /cinnamon hens 25.0% 0.1 grey(sf) blue cinnamon 25.0% 0.1 blue cinnam...
by trabots
Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:42 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Saddleback ?
Replies: 186
Views: 27155

Re: Saddleback ?

Great response Ben. Cheers.
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Saddleback ?
Replies: 186
Views: 27155

Re: Saddleback ?

Ben, I had a couple of 'Dom' Edged birds around 10 years ago when they were known as 'fallows' and supposedly all cocks were split Cinnamon. You probably know the story. The image you just posted http://parakeet.me/irn/f/dftuqEdged.jpg is stunning however please try and get me interested as all I ha...
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:12 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Odd markings?
Replies: 13
Views: 1334

Re: Odd markings?

What did you do to the python?
Took him for a ride and let him slither away. I would have liked to keep him however here in Oz you can get a pretty big fine for keeping native species without permits etc.
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 6:09 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Hi Gratz, not too sure yet about your perceptions of green and blue. This is your last image of your EmeraldBlue which I see as being the same as mine. Taken straight on or at 90 degrees. In my eyes definitely bluer than green. http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a501/Allpetsaviaries/20131105_093659...
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:15 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Odd markings?
Replies: 13
Views: 1334

Re: Odd markings?

Recio, here is another image. The feathers may moult in devoid of structure and pigment but they are also brittle and then get ragged from preening as time goes on. It seemed diet related because the lorikeets involved improved in my aviaries. I never bred one myself. A galah I have had for 18 years...
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 4:47 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Not implying trickery by you Gratz, the camera angle does the tricks. Any change in the incidence angle of a blueish feather as in a Parblue will alter the blue tones, decreasing them makes the feather greener looking. In the 1st image the TurquoiseBlue's flights are at 90 degrees to your camera whe...
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:54 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Gratz, I know Phil and we have been to each others aviaries. Deon's df Emerald is Phil's bird via Chris. These latest pics agree with mine, the flights are those of a parblue. The green appearance of the flights was obviously a trick of the lighting etc. We are back with Mike's results, 7 chicks fro...
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:38 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Sherjil, where can we find "Babu's profile"? Cheers.
by trabots
Tue Nov 05, 2013 1:36 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Molossus, the first order of business now is to breed a clean Dhani. Babu sure makes us work for it. Can you get an image from him of the original mutant?
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:57 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Odd markings?
Replies: 13
Views: 1334

Re: Odd markings?

The feathers are clearly ragged at the ends. They are not mutant feathers they are damaged feathers IMO. I have had plenty of these feathers over the years.

Image
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:46 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

My dhani hen is a mustard brown bird. It has an overtone of mauve. None of the chicks look like their mother. One of the young is clearly a Blue, the other is not. In order for one to be Blue the Dhani hen is split Blue. For neither chick to look like the mother, either of the parents has to have a...
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:40 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

the cock paired to a blue/ctail bred a violet grey bird...go figure??? I presume that the Violet Grey was proven by breeding? Grey would mask Violet so how else would you know? If the cock indeed bred a Grey I would use a different Blue which you know breeds normally, otherwise you are adding anoth...
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:29 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: SL Edged
Replies: 275
Views: 28694

Re: SL Edged

Pluck a couple of adjacent blackened feathers outside of moulting time. They will no doubt grow in ok and then start losing colour and are brittle at the ends which get ragged from normal preening. I had the same feather issues with some of my lorikeets. Improved diet seemed to assist. It is not a c...
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:43 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

The green flights are actually bluish now? Gratz if you have a TurquoiseBlue how about a comparison?
by trabots
Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:38 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Molossus, is this the pairing? Blue x Dhani /Blue? Just because the birds are grey coloured doesn't mean Grey is involved. Why would your source mess things up with a new mutation by putting Grey into them?
by trabots
Sun Nov 03, 2013 3:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Ben, how do you reconcile the flights colour?
by trabots
Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:29 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EmeraldTurquoise
Replies: 4
Views: 364

Re: EmeraldTurquoise

Mike's results back up the Emerald parblue theory....but then we have green winged Emeralds breeding Blue birds..(Gratz')
by trabots
Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:26 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

A Parblue has only 2 phenotypes with none visible in Green series.
Sorry, : When I say Green series I mean a wildtype Blue locus, both sides.
by trabots
Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:04 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

What has changed to believe that Emerald is not a Parblue mutation? Ben, no change for sure with me yet however in the meantime, with respect to Gratz' bird and assuming: We now have evidence of 3 phenotypes. Chris' DF Emerald, Gratz' bird and my birds. Gratz' bird is SF but is different to my SF E...
by trabots
Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:56 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Gratz, looks like you have a mystery bird. If it bred a Blue, you have possibly a SF Emerald /Blue not a SF Emerald Blue which logically mine would be if we are talking an incomplete dominant Emerald mutation. All of my straight Emeralds have the bluish flights. While we are on it, how about some ot...
by trabots
Sat Nov 02, 2013 4:15 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

my emerald hen was bred by Phillip Highland and it has green flights nothing like a turquoise flights I knew these would come in handy, they also make great wings for balsa wood air planes. Gratz, if the flights are green but you aren't breeding all Emeralds then we have a mystery top EmeraldBlueTu...
by trabots
Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:54 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

the Deep Green Pallid must be nice. Pallid is so much nicer in Green series IMO.
by trabots
Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:13 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

the thing that puzzles me is the non df emeralds that produce 100% offspring ... are these co incidental?? Breeders in Oz are breeding EmeraldBlues together, and then selling off the df birds without realising what they have. The new owner just assumes he has an EmeraldBlue. To get a DF Emerald you...
by trabots
Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:57 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Kappa, what hen did you breed your Deep Green to and are you in Australia?
by trabots
Wed Oct 30, 2013 2:59 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Back to Emerald inheritance. As Molosus and Willy say there are reports of apparent SF Emeralds producing almost 100% Emerald offspring or at least higher numbers than the expected 50%. Which could be the underlying mechanism? Any idea? Food for thougth for this weekend. These 'emeralds' which are ...
by trabots
Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:16 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: What am I?
Replies: 19
Views: 707

Re: What am I?

I have no excuses in any event, no Ino eyes!!
by trabots
Tue Oct 29, 2013 4:11 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Recio, this pair was apparently owned by the first ever breeder of a Deep Blue who is now deceased. He obtained the Deep Greens from the Smiths. I don't know if they were already /Blue or whether he did the initial breeding of /Blues. The Deep Blue might in fact be a Blue for all we know and that pa...
by trabots
Tue Oct 29, 2013 4:06 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: What am I?
Replies: 19
Views: 707

Re: What am I?

Madas, you led us astray with the "ino" in the name. Probably your smiley's indicated that was not the case. I do not know the meanings of most smileys so only went on the assumption that it was one of 3 Parblue Inos. In any even I'll bet that you would be hard pressed to tell an EmeraldBlue Ino fro...
by trabots
Tue Oct 29, 2013 7:56 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?
Replies: 155
Views: 14608

Re: pictures of Deep and Dark Greens?

Deep Green and Deep Blue, mature birds

Image
by trabots
Tue Oct 29, 2013 7:50 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: What am I?
Replies: 19
Views: 707

Re: What am I?

It is definitely not a TurquoiseBlue Ino so it can only be possibly an IndgoBlue Ino or probably an EmeraldBlue Ino.
by trabots
Sun Oct 27, 2013 3:23 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emeralds dominance?
Replies: 54
Views: 3173

Re: Emeralds dominance?

Molossus, my breedings so far show roughly 50/50 EmeraldBlues and Blues from EmeraldBlue x Blue. I have heard of breeders only breeding EmeraldBlues however.
by trabots
Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:38 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

Violet Emerald under-wing pic
This matches my Violet EmeraldBlue
by trabots
Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:22 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emerald inheritance
Replies: 125
Views: 7773

Re: Emerald inheritance

I just wonder, if Willy's patched emeralds were violet also, would it look as light as the one Madas posted? Here is an update of the 'patched emeralds'. As you can see they are clearly different from a TurquoiseBlue, the darker green being different and coming in in different areas of the bird. Al...
by trabots
Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:48 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

Image

Got it Madas, cheers
by trabots
Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:44 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emerald inheritance
Replies: 125
Views: 7773

Re: Emerald inheritance

I posted images of a Violet Emerald on the "Emerald" thread. Not the same
by trabots
Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:41 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EMERALD
Replies: 8
Views: 1328

Re: EMERALD

I would pair it with either a violet or a cobalt. a Violet EmeraldBlue for reference flash and no flash. A pretty bird [URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabots/media/Trabots%20IRNs/VioletEmeraldBlueflash_zpsac1fdeda.jpg.html][img]http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/Trabots%20IRNs...
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:40 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

Here is that last pic. Photobucket sucks. Sure would like a quick tutorial for all as in "Pasting images on Indianringneck.com posts for dummies" CW, Dark, Dark Violet, Deep Dark Violet, Deep Dark [URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabots/media/Trabots%20IRNs/cwDarkDarkVioletDeepDarkVioletDeepD...
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:30 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

How are you guys re-posting my images without the URL business? I deleted the originals from Photobucket but they are still in the posts??
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:21 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

Hi Willy, I was browsing through your picture gallery (again!), and noticed the label: Deep, Deep Dark, Deep Dark Violet, Deep Violet Blues I screwed up again, must have been Deep in thought. Again I apologise. The file name for the very first image is wrong also. I will repost the images with corr...
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:46 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep cobalt violet
Replies: 11
Views: 745

Re: Deep cobalt violet

Ignore, last post I am having a bad run of things, sorry folks. No more trick questions! After checking my original I find that the label is correct, the file name is wrong. Then looking at the tails and flights I confirm the Deep Blue is in the middle as you have said. This was taken by the fellow ...
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:36 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep cobalt violet
Replies: 11
Views: 745

Re: Deep cobalt violet

Willy, can you please confirm these birds? The label says cobalt, deep blue, cobalt. The filename says 2xDeepBlueCobalt. Not my birds, they are 2 x Deep Blues on the left and a Cobalt right. Always look at the tail feathers if possible. The file name is correct, I must have made yet another mistake...
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 6:32 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep cobalt violet
Replies: 11
Views: 745

Re: Deep cobalt violet

No mate, I have 2 for sure triples, Deep Dark Violet Blue and several Violet Mauves. I also have a possible DF Deep Violet. That's it for now. Now that I have Deep Dark Blues I will be working on the DF Deep Dark Blue as soon as I can.
by trabots
Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:20 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep cobalt violet
Replies: 11
Views: 745

Re: Deep cobalt violet

You should find what you need in here, its a library of images mostly my birds and many have been posted on this forum.

http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabo ... wap&page=1
by trabots
Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:44 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: EMERALD
Replies: 8
Views: 1328

Re: EMERALD

Hi, if I had an Emerald and not much else it would have to be just a Blue to pair it with so half your young would be Emeralds (EmeraldBlues until proven otherwise). If you have other birds to choose or can buy, I would buy another Emerald to breed df Emeralds and EmeraldBlues which would set you up...
by trabots
Mon Oct 21, 2013 4:29 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Just testing you ...............hah, I mean duh! Meanwhile are these pics related at all? Don't know where they came from. [URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabots/media/Trabots%20IRNs/DSC02844.jpg.html][img]http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/Trabots%20IRNs/DSC02844.jpg[/img] [/u...
by trabots
Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:27 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Well for once we have a mutation name which has nothing to do with colour but has many meanings in Hindi for great wealth. The departed Beatle, George Harrison's son Dhani fits the bill, with a worth of some $250 million. I too look forward to the fledged images and of course will then be trying to ...
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:41 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

detailed info will be discussed on the genetics ext.
Sorry, I failed to see this. Where can we find??
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 3:42 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

Skyes, next time I will try and remember the wing shot. Remember however that any comparison is futile unless they are together in the same image. The Cobalt in the image looks Blue, just as an example because there is no Blue bird in the image.
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 3:38 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Introducing the Dhani
Replies: 58
Views: 5771

Re: Introducing the Dhani

Good stuff Madas, they are the end birds? These appear slightly different shades, are other mutations involved. Is the middle bird a Blue or a Parblue?
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:16 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

The hen looks to have a Dark factor and one other unknown factor. IMO the chick is a combination of all 3.
Just realised how dumb that was. 2 Dark factors makes a Mauve so I am mystified again.
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:14 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: triple structural mutations
Replies: 22
Views: 1211

Re: triple structural mutations

Further to this I got a pretty good pic of the Deep Dark Violet and siblings: cw, Dark, Dark Violet, Deep Dark Violet, Deep Dark [URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabots/media/Trabots%20IRNs/cwDarkDarkVioletDeepDarkVioletDeepDark.jpg.html][img]http://i1305.photobucket.com/albums/s541/Trabots/T...
by trabots
Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:02 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

Great pics Madas. The mystery Blue bird when you blow it up there is the tell tale mauve blush on the face and neck so I make the father a Dark TurquoiseBlue. The hen looks to have a Dark factor and one other unknown factor. IMO the chick is a combination of all 3.
by trabots
Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:23 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

very valid point Willy. Sorry, but I don't think it is. Ben, the article you posted has Terry's recommendation that it should be paired with another one. Whether a modifier gene or not, it will still have a locus which it calls home and that locus has room for two. There is therefore obvious logic ...
by trabots
Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:11 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

I know, I know, same old query from me, but if a renowned breeder has had a new Blue IRN since 2004, why has the DF version not been bred 9 years later?? Only the homozygous bird will give the knowledge.
by trabots
Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:01 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

Not doubting you at all Ben as Sheyd has said, I was just showing another candy cane ringneck image which I came across, nothing to do with your posts in between. Sorry to have raised your hackles mate. I raised the question about this image long ago and Maxine advised that it was a Cobalt Violet. ...
by trabots
Tue Oct 15, 2013 11:43 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

Not doubting you at all Ben as Sheyd has said, I was just showing another candy cane ringneck image which I came across, nothing to do with your posts in between. Sorry to have raised your hackles mate. I raised the question about this image long ago and Maxine advised that it was a Cobalt Violet. I...
by trabots
Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:18 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Pick One - Cast your vote !
Replies: 185
Views: 11835

Re: Pick One - Cast your vote !

And this one of a Cobalt Violet

[URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/ ... .jpg[/img][/url]
by trabots
Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:50 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep and Dark and Violet are non-allelic
Replies: 8
Views: 667

Re: Deep and Dark and Violet are non-allelic

What I have is only the mother SF Deep Violet TurquoiseBlue and this youngster. Sometimes the Turquoise is a PIA, I would have much preferred not having it in this instance.
by trabots
Tue Oct 15, 2013 3:08 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: green violet clearhead fallow male
Replies: 17
Views: 1240

Re: green violet clearhead fallow male

I think the bird I underlined is rather a SF violet green / CHF, with the bird at 11 o'clock a DF violet green / CHF.
Nope, there are 3 red eyed CHFs and a DF Violet Green split, ignore the bird at 11pm, not a ringneck. Both DF Violet Greens have their heads hidden, one is a CHF, the one at 12pm.
by trabots
Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:51 am
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Emerald Cleartail phoenetics
Replies: 58
Views: 4943

Re: Emerald Cleartail phoenetics

I am convinced about the Emerald in the birds, that's the value of images over words. Still would like to see the EmeraldTurquoise parent.

Madas, is what you saw the same as Chris' image above?
by trabots
Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:47 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: Deep and Dark and Violet are non-allelic
Replies: 8
Views: 667

Re: Deep and Dark and Violet are non-allelic

Tienie, this bird I think is a DF Deep Violet TurquoiseBlue. It appears darker than its Deep Violet TurquoiseBlue mother at this stage, confirmation of these birds usually has to wait until the 3 month moult. [URL=http://s1305.photobucket.com/user/Trabots/media/Trabots%20IRNs/DFDeepVioletTurqBlue.jp...
by trabots
Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:41 pm
Forum: Mutations/Genetics
Topic: green violet clearhead fallow male
Replies: 17
Views: 1240

Re: green violet clearhead fallow male

I will have images shortly of Violet Green CH Fallow and DF Violet Green CH Fallow soon, this is the clutch last week. From 12 o'clock CW, DF Violet Green CHF, DF Violet Green /CHF, Violet Green CHF, Green CHF, from another clutch, Dark Violet Green, all /Blue. Flash used. [URL=http://s1305.photobuc...